Sept 2nd News - I wont be doing Scales of War

[Goumindong]

You show a rather obvious lack of understanding what DMs need, despite your claims of experience. You also ignore that WotC itself advices DMs to get an outline of a campaign. The rest of your arguments show the sadly usual confusing of D&D for Star Wars.

More ad hominem.

A question. You realize that I am saying the information is valuable to DM's, right? Its that the argument that says there is no difference between spoiling the next adventure and spoiling the entire adventure relies on the statement "outlines provide valuable information to DM's" must be false. Since the arguer is claiming that both statements are true, one of the statements must be incorrect.

 

[Goumindong]

No, it hasn't actualy.

Ah now you FINALLY tell me the logic behind your reason.

Eh, not my fault you didn't read the thread

Downloading a full adventure might get you advanced information by a month or a few sessions. In all likelihood there are going to be hints to that specific reveal anyway. With information on the entire path out there you are likely to find out that the guy who is hiring you is actually a member of the devious black jugglers and you're getting them an artifact that they will use 4 adventures down the line to summon a demon.

You give an example of being spoiled. An example that once again, has your players going out of their way to spoil the adventure for themselves. This is a problem with your PLAYERS, not the fact that the information is available.

Actually my example was with me getting spoiled while not having read the adventure or having an interest in finding out what was going to happen.

This is a terribly naive view of the situation. I have neither played nor read Keep on the Shadowfell, but i know enough about the module just from off hand comments from people who have to get a good enough idea of what I can expect

This is the second time you have ignored text in the post you were quoting. Stop doing it. Read the damn thread.

If you can't figure out how information disseminates even if the disseminators and disseminatees don't want it to then i don't know what to say for you.

 

[Wonka]

Eh, not my fault you didn't read the thread

And its not my fault you don't listen to your own advice. I did read the thread and I did read all those points. And as I said, none of those satisfactorily gives enough reason to your argument, IN MY OPINION. And as I said before, I agree to disagree. Perhaps you should as well.

Im going to say this one more time. I don't feel the POTENTIAL to spoil information for the players is a valid reason for withholding information the DM needs to run an adventure. PERIOD. Nothing you have said convinces me otherwise, nor will. Nothing I say will convince you otherwse, nor will it. Now, i really need to listen to myself and stop responding to you, you are wasting my Spore time.

 

[Goumindong]

Well, the world doesn't revolve around you. The fact that you don't care for reasons why these things might have been withheld does not delegitimize the reasons. I read the thread, i understand the conversation that is going on.

And no, the DM does not need the information to run the adventure. This has been covered already. It will be helpful, but it is not necessary.

 

[Fenes]

Well, the world doesn't revolve around you. The fact that you don't care for reasons why these things might have been withheld does not delegitimize the reasons. I read the thread, i understand the conversation that is going on.

And no, the DM does not need the information to run the adventure. This has been covered already. It will be helpful, but it is not necessary.

If you go striclty by "need" you don't need a lot of things. You don't even "need" the adventure to run it, some off-hand info ("Spoilers") is enough.

I think you're just unwilling or unable to understand that not everyone plays like you do - which seems to be "read the adventure verbatim, don't modify it, don't customise, don't edit".

And you keep dodging the question why WotC wouldn't evne follow their own advice from the DMG.

 

[Goumindong]

If you go striclty by "need" you don't need a lot of things. You don't even "need" the adventure to run it, some off-hand info ("Spoilers") is enough.

I think you're just unwilling or unable to understand that not everyone plays like you do - which seems to be "read the adventure verbatim, don't modify it, don't customise, don't edit".

And you keep dodging the question why WotC wouldn't evne follow their own advice from the DMG.

You're assuming. I modify, customize and edit when necessary or desired. And if doing so, can easily do so for further down the line. Oh noes, you killed off an important NPC. Well now you know, pick an appropriate other NPC and substitute. A synopsis is by no means required to improvise, edit, and cusomtimze.

And no, you are wrong about Wizards following their own advice. They are, they have an outline. They are the one creating the adventure path and so the purpose of the outline, to focus the creation of said adventure path, is being fulfilled.

 

[Wonka]

Well, the world doesn't revolve around you. The fact that you don't care for reasons why these things might have been withheld does not delegitimize the reasons. I read the thread, i understand the conversation that is going on.

Yes, because I said my opinion was the end all didn't I? Of course the world doesn't revolve around me. Nor does it revolve around you. This works both ways. Just because you offer reasons why they are might be withholding this information, doesn't delegitimize the complaints a lot of other DMs seem to have with the lack of the overview. I read the thread also, I also understand whats going on.

And no, the DM does not need the information to run the adventure. This has been covered already. It will be helpful, but it is not necessary.

Again, this is your OPINION. Perhaps I should have edited my prior statement. Of course not EVERY DM needs this information. You obviously don't, and I appluad your ability to run a cohesive story without such info. I, and it would seem quite a few other DMs, are not so fortunate with the ability to adlib like you. I DO need the information to run a good story, at least as far as what I consider a good campaign. Does this make me a bad dm? Does your ability to ad lib make you a better DM than me? Again, not going to answer because all id be offering is my opinion. The question becomes (at least how I see it), when it seems more than one DM would need this information to run what they consider a proper campaign, are their complaints suddenly any less valid?

 

[Eccles]

Personally I'm happy (in a way) there's no synopsis, as I'm sharing DM duties with someone else, and we're doing an adventure each in turn. If there was a synopsis, I'd have to read it, and I might know what was coming!

The 1st adventure does have some items of potential foreshadowing - the Rivenroars, the note and the portal, as Goumindong pointed out.

The only problem is I (as DM) can't point out whether any of these are significant. Whilst the note's obviously important, and the players have a copy, the Rivenroars and the funny portal-place might be totally meaningless, and I don't know whether to stress it or leave it as interesting backround. Unless I'm told in advance that the Rivenroars are going to be important, I can't really make a big deal of them!

 

[Fenes]

And no, you are wrong about Wizards following their own advice. They are, they have an outline. They are the one creating the adventure path and so the purpose of the outline, to focus the creation of said adventure path, is being fulfilled.

You keep missing the point about being a DM. A DM means we need that outline to run a campaign, as everyone who ever DMed should understand.

 

[Goumindong]

Sigh, i guess you still don't get it. I am not the one making the judgment. The choice is not mine. You, and others, have been saying that WotC is wrong to not release them, and this is false. Its objectively false because its a value judgment on their part based on the research they have done. Unless there are no valid reasons to withhold, which we have established now that there are then your objections are invalid.