Shield Charge equivalent?

[Rel]

Let me know how this one works for ya'...

Bugger. I knew that was going to happen.

But I'll have you know, I am somebody, dammit! I'm the guy who ripped off Old One's extremely cool campaign setting, ran my own campaign in it, started a Story Hour about it and three quarters through the campaign, stopped posting while continuously promising to post (and I mean it, I really will post an update someday soon ). Sure I may be only half the bastard that you are, but that is bastard enough for most.

Worst of all, you may have struck me down, but now I've become more powerful than ever! You see, I am now among those who have been "feated" by kreynolds. And that, my friend, is a very exclusive club including only 2/3 of the total EN World membership.

So, ha! Or something.

And by the way, I still think that the Cheeky Monkey feat is a must for your forthcoming book.

 

[IceBear]

Another example of someone looking at something *in theory* and jumping to the conclusion it needs to be banned - you don't even know if any player is going to take it.

What I would do in your position is to let a player know that you're unsure about this feat and allow him to swap to another feat if you should change your mind and actually test out the effectiveness in play, as opposed to theory.

Sure, the feat, coupled with the spell, makes shield charges dangerous but as many people have told you, you don't get to charge all that often.

IceBear

 

[kreynolds]

And by the way, I still think that the Cheeky Monkey feat is a must for your forthcoming book.

Intriguing. Tell me more about dis'....Cheeky Monkey.

 

[Rel]

Intriguing. Tell me more about dis'....Cheeky Monkey.

Oh no. It was Mistwell that brought it up. Ask him.

I already took a pretty good feating earlier and I'm not looking for another.

 

[0-hr]

Another example of someone looking at something *in theory* and jumping to the conclusion it needs to be banned - you don't even know if any player is going to take it.

Au contrain mon Bear! I brought this up exactly because I've been watching Rhino Hide + Spikes + Shield Charge start off every fight I've been in for the last several months. Anyway, I came here, asked my question, got some good answers, and made my decision. At this point I'm just respondnig to questions/insults and watching in amazement as the thread refuses to die.

Just now, though, I thought of a different house rule. Maybe I'll say "You can only Shield Charge with a metal shield" rather than "Shield Charge and Spikes do not work in concert". That seems a bit more elegant, and a tad more logical.

And yes, my penultimate post was sarcasm.

 

[Mistwell]

I brought this up exactly because I've been watching Rhino Hide + Spikes + Shield Charge start off every fight I've been in for the last several months.

Why not make it a half-orc cleric with max str, power lunge, and an activated divine shield while your at it

 

[IceBear]

Ok, so this character always starts off his fight this way. In a campaign I was playing in we were all knights and we started every combat by charging with a lance.

The question is, does this character dominate combat after the charge? If so, then you have the evidence to work from that I don't, and thus you are in the position to make the ruling.

If it's just that it's annoying to see him start every combat the same way, well, that's just as annoying as watching a wizard fireball every group of orcs he sees.

IceBear

 

[Mistwell]

I think it is a pretty uncreative response to just ban the use of the wooden shield with spikes, just because you do not like how the PC is using this tactic.

If you really don't like how the player is using it, just be more creative in how you handle the issue. For example:

1) Have some monsters set a spear against this character as a readied action a few times;
2) Have the terrain be more difficult to move through, by natural means or spells such as web, entangle, grease, etc..;
3) Use more flying creatures, or burrowing creatures;
4) Set up monsters in an area that is in sight, but not in a straight line to attack, such as monsters behind a barrier pelting the PC's with ranged weapons, preventing a charge over the barrier;
5) Set up more floor-based traps between the PC's and the monsters. You can even have a trap triggered by anything that moves across it at high speeds. For example, if the monsters move at 30 feet in 6 seconds, that means they cross a 5 foot square every second, while in combat. Make a trap that triggers if anything crosses it at a speed of .9 seconds or faster.
6) Use monsters with higher initiatives, and have them close with the PC before he can get a charge off.

I'm sure others can offer more ideas to deal with this problem. I just think it will be more satisfying for eveyone involved if you don't ban the tactic, rather than just adding more consequences for its use.

 

[Kae'Yoss]

Shields are perfectly capable of using the full-attack option, if you attack with one normally

Right you are. You cannot charge AND get the iterative attacks, so a sword will win out against a shield charge because you can attack more than once with that sword and that can easily add up to more than double damage.

 

[smetzger]

You can't charge and Spring Attack. Also, even if you could why would your opponent not get to you to retaliate? Is he not allowed to charge as well?

Yes, you can. You just won't be able to move after your charge action, but you will gain the Spring Attack benefit of not drawing an AoO from the target you charge (provided the target has reach).

However, a more interesting question is:
Would a charging spring attack protect you from the AoO from Hold the Line?