D&D (2024) Simplify opportunity attacks to deal flat damage?

[Retreater]

I think that a big part of this is because 5e removed basically all of the things with a clear cost/benefit to weigh against the cost of provoking an AoO (ranged attacks, cast a spell, object interactions, aid another, read a scroll, use a skill that takes an action, most movement, etc). Players chasrge up with their full move speed at no cost to their attack chain & stand there playing rockemsockemrobots till they need a new target.

More true with PF1/3.x, but the players who are used to that carry the mentality into whichever system.

 

[GMMichael]

To prevent out of turn disruptions, and keep the game flowing..

What if opportunity attacks where just a bit of auto-damage? No rolling,
just running past the cleric and you take 5 damage.
Fighters could deal 5 without using their reactions or something.
Wizards deal 2, rogues might deal 5+1/2 their level or whatever.

Cool idea, but I find that out of turn disruptions actually increase engagement and combat flow.

 

[tetrasodium]

More true with PF1/3.x, but the players who are used to that carry the mentality into whichever system.

I pulled most of the list from the 3.5 AoO table 8-2 but you missed the point I was making. Doing those other things had a positive impact on combat flow & engagement by making the risk of provoking a thing to consider the benefits against that cost. In 5e the rules go beyond simply exempting most of those from provoking & go straight on to ensuring that those things aren't important or aren't even meaningful options. Even if a player steps away from a monster for whatever reason to provoke an OA it doesn't really change anything in the grand scale of the combat itself... gonna get dropped? ->healing word! Caught in melee with a ranged weapon? -> Sheath a weapon no longer provokes! But what about if you want to sheath the bow & draw a rapier? -> the object interaction rules on 190 are so vague & overly generous that they are hardly an impediment there even before the disaster of having them opt out of the action economy so they could strip standard/full round/free/swift action as terms & just have "action".

 

[Horwath]

We need more situations where AoO happens, not less.
And more damage.

Removing it from many situations made melee characters weaker.

Return the 5ft step rule as a move action.
Maybe Bonus action for rogues and some other subclasses and/or feats.

Add AoO provoking to:
Making ranged attacks
Casting spells that are not melee touch spells or spell directly originating from caster(cones, blasts)

Separate AoO from Reaction cost and add separate counter that you can make AoO once per any opponents turn.

New feat:
Combat reflexes;
+1 Str, Dex or Con
You have advantage on your AoO attacks,
Your AoO attacks deal maximum damage.

 

[Clint_L]

From the perspective of my table, this looks like a solution in search of a problem.

 

[Scott Christian]

This is what I would do if I was going to change anything. Frankly OAs are so rare in the games I run that I don't mind a few extra rolls, but if you do want to simplify, going with average seems an easy way to do it.

That's interesting. They are not rare in our games. In fact, they almost always occur at least one or two times an encounter. It's interesting how tables are so different.

 

[tetrasodium]

That's interesting. They are not rare in our games. In fact, they almost always occur at least one or two times an encounter. It's interesting how tables are so different.

I almost never see 5e players risking an AoO either, there just are not enough things capable of provoking one during normal combat in 5e's ruleset. With the loss of single attack and full found full attack along with so many other things capable of provoking them they just don't happen much unless the GM is making monsters walk face first into that branch just so their players can make one. New players might not notice the GM doing that but it's pretty quickly going to get noticed with experience.

 

[Justice and Rule]

I almost never see 5e players risking an AoO either, there just are not enough things capable of provoking one during normal combat in 5e's ruleset. With the loss of single attack and full found full attack along with so many other things capable of provoking them they just don't happen much unless the GM is making monsters walk face first into that branch just so their players can make one. New players might not notice the GM doing that but it's pretty quickly going to get noticed with experience.

Even more than that, the ability to basically walk around within someone's reach really adds to the ability to avoid them: if you or the enemy are able to support each other in combat, it's not hard to shift around to be able to attack a new target without necessarily getting hit by an AoO.

When I was redoing the Fighter, I did something similar to @Horwath and basically made it the Champion Subclass's gimmick to be the 5E version of a 4E Defender. Basically anyone you hit you would Mark, and get a free Attack of Opportunity on if they moved or attacked someone other than you, along with the "Your speed drops to 0" effect on a hit. This didn't use your Reaction, but if you lost your Reaction due to an effect you couldn't use it.

I also let them spend a Movement Action to enter a stance where anyone who left your melee range counted as being marked. I had a ranged stance, too, called Overwatch where any targets that were marked (because you could be marked by a ranged attack) would generated an AoO if they moved faster than 10 feet. Allowed a range fighter to really effectively harry ranged targets in a way others couldn't. So if they stood still every turn, they could essentially lock down globs from moving at all.