D&D 5E (2024) So, what does the Artificer "replace"?

[Remathilis]

Me: Hmmm I wonder what people are discussing about the party role of the Artificer?

Me, opening this thread:

 

[Charlaquin]

Me: Hmmm I wonder what people are discussing about the party role of the Artificer?

Me, opening this thread:
View attachment 424778

Yeah, somehow that’s still what happens any time 4e gets mentioned…

 

[Cap'n Kobold]

I'm thinking the best builds aren't the high damage dealing ones.

No, but Artificer gets lots of Cure Wounds and Web spells, at the point that others can cast Heal or Mass suggestion.

 

[Zardnaar]

Yeah, despite the adage that “dead is the best Condition,” damage is generally not the most efficient path to ending a combat encounter in 5e. Monsters just have enough HP that it’s usually easier to use debilitating spells instead.

Well its more debilitating spell plus lots of damage. Team effort. Spellcaster damage is usually lackluster.

 

[Zardnaar]

No, but Artificer gets lots of Cure Wounds and Web spells, at the point that others can cast Heal or Mass suggestion.

Aware

D&D 5E (2024) Thread 'Cartographer May be Underrated. The Cheerleader A Build.'

Yesterday at 11:13 PM

So the cartographer has the reputation of being the weakest artificer. Im not sure about that as you have a few more options. For example the artilerist and battlesmith probably have other things to do with their actions. And may have to use spell slots to do their thing.

Expanding on This thread.


Basically I suggested the cartographer will make a good support character. I'm going to double down on that and add controller as well. All artificers at level 11+ are going to benefit from spell storing...

• Zardnaar
• Replies: 8
• Forum: *Dungeons & Dragons

• 

 

[Mephista]

I'm not unaware of the inherent oddness of complaining that the Artificer is relying on "gimmicks".
But using multiple minions and mass-produced wands is only one playstyle, and not all subclasses get to do it well.

Two smol things:
By "get to do it well," can I presume you mean have multiple pets? IE the battlemaster and reanimator subclasses?

And I just want to mention that that, if you just have the HS out and pinging people with its default blast? It puts your cantrip spam on par with the warlock's EB+AB spam when combined with the subclasses' boosts to damage. At least in tier 2. So, I think its a good baseline, and anything above that is just a matter of taste, tactics and personal style.

I think I'm going to write up a full thread of my own on all my thoughts on the new Artificer, and put all my babbling there.

 

[Zardnaar]

Two smol things:
By "get to do it well," can I presume you mean have multiple pets? IE the battlemaster and reanimator subclasses?

And I just want to mention that that, if you just have the HS out and pinging people with its default blast? It puts your cantrip spam on par with the warlock's EB+AB spam when combined with the subclasses' boosts to damage. At least in tier 2. So, I think its a good baseline, and anything above that is just a matter of taste, tactics and personal style.

I think I'm going to write up a full thread of my own on all my thoughts on the new Artificer, and put all my babbling there.

Ive just done cartographer. I've got some thoughts on the others.

 

[Cap'n Kobold]

Two smol things:
By "get to do it well," can I presume you mean have multiple pets? IE the battlemaster and reanimator subclasses?

And I just want to mention that that, if you just have the HS out and pinging people with its default blast? It puts your cantrip spam on par with the warlock's EB+AB spam when combined with the subclasses' boosts to damage. At least in tier 2. So, I think its a good baseline, and anything above that is just a matter of taste, tactics and personal style.

I think I'm going to write up a full thread of my own on all my thoughts on the new Artificer, and put all my babbling there.

I more meant that while the wands of Magic Missile are ones that any of the subclasses can make, the Spell Storing Item is very subclass-dependent, leading to some of them not doing well when relying on it for a good chunk of power.
When using multiple minions as wand-casters, you can use a Familiar from outside the class, or Tiny Servants from the spell, or craft some of the semiautonomous constructs during downtime or your Replicate Magic Item feature. - That isn't so subclass-dependent.

The Artificer has reasonable consistent long-term damage, and at the level that they get SSI it is very competitive. But Warlocks consistently get multiple casts of 5th-level spells, and not only get access to a 6th-level spells, but continue to scale by getting further high-level spells as they level further.

 

[Zardnaar]

I more meant that while the wands of Magic Missile are ones that any of the subclasses can make, the Spell Storing Item is very subclass-dependent, leading to some of them not doing well when relying on it for a good chunk of power.
When using multiple minions as wand-casters, you can use a Familiar from outside the class, or Tiny Servants from the spell, or craft some of the semiautonomous constructs during downtime or your Replicate Magic Item feature. - That isn't so subclass-dependent.

The Artificer has reasonable consistent long-term damage, and at the level that they get SSI it is very competitive. But Warlocks consistently get multiple casts of 5th-level spells, and not only get access to a 6th-level spells, but continue to scale by getting further high-level spells as they level further.

White room theory craft i think its when you get hit by 3 or 4 spells at once via a broadside. Warlock cant do that.

Its not obvious for casuals, higher level subclass depending and depending on how much of a killer your DM or how many AoE they use.

If abused killing pets is a higher priority.

 

[Remathilis]

White room theory craft i think its when you get hit by 3 or 4vspells at once via a broadside. Warlock cant do that.

Its not obvious for casuals, higher level subclass depending and depending on how much of a killer your DM or how many AoE they use.

If abused killing pets is a higher priority.

I know the optimizer community relies on a half dozen pets using wands and Spell storing items to spam multiple spells per round, but and player who tries to rely on that is going to find his army targets of enemy attacks.

(The same thing was true of conjuring large amounts of pixies or controlling an battalion of skeletons with longbows).