Spell points: CON or CHA?

[R.T.]

Hi

I'm thinking a bit about some sort of spell point (mana) system for casting spells, but I'm not sure what to base the number of spell points available to a character on. I think that when you use spell points, you're working with an innate form of magic (somewhat like the sorcerer's magic), even when it's used by wizards. But what should this innate force be based on (apart from character level)? Charisma represents your force of personality, while Constitution represents your life force. Somehow, life force seems more appropriate, but Con doesn't strike me as a "typical" caster ability (it's more fighter-related).

If anyone has an opinion, or a better way to determine spell points, I'd love to hear it.

 

[Planesdragon]

AASB uses spell points, called "mana"

As Above, So Below uses a mana system instead of vancian magic. (never fancied vancian magic.)

Leaving out the spell revisions, sources of magic, and other bits that will wind their way into the book in the next few months, AASB as a new "Essence" ability scorre, which measures the magical potential of a character, and assigns each spellcaster a mana die.

(There are also Mystic feats, allowing non-spellcasters to take advantage of their Essence score.)

For D&D with six stats, I'd suggest giving each spellcaster bonus mana based on their prime requisite--intelligence for wizards and rangers, charisma for bards and sorcerors, wisdom for clerics and druids.

 

[Dr.Dan]

Charisma represents your force of personality, while Constitution represents your life force. Somehow, life force seems more appropriate, but Con doesn't strike me as a "typical" caster ability (it's more fighter-related).

If I were introducing a mana system, I think that I would choose Charisma over Constitution for granting points and I would do so for two reasons:

1- I view Charisma as more than just a measure of personality. It’s your ability to impose your will on the world around you, and magic is the ultimate imposition of ones will.
2- Looking at it from an OOG / mechanical point of view, players already have plenty of reasons to boost their Con scores. More hit points and better saves are good things regardless of your class, and let us not forget that bonus to concentration checks. Constitution is already one of the most potent ability scores. Adding any more reasons to boost it would start to make it a bit lop-sided.

That having been said, I’d be inclined to grant spell points based on whatever ability the casters spells are already tied to – Wis for divine spells, Int for prepared arcane spells (which won’t be prepared under your system, but still . . .), and Cha for spontaneous spellcasters.

Just my 2 cents.

Dr. Dan

 

[R.T.]

Hmm, you definitely have a point about Constitution becoming too interesting for a player. I'm gonna sit on this issue a while longer.

 

[VirtualWizard]

There is no reason that you can't use both. Perhaps CON provides a character's begining mana points, but CHA represents the refined use of the character's life force. Basically, CON provides a few begining mana points, but CHA adds mana per level.

 

[AdamBank]

Hit Dice plus Magic Dice?

If you are looking for universal "magic" points--points that all creatures (or magic users) have regardless of their magical tradition--consider basing them on Intelligence. I like using Int because then you have a symmetrical physical/mental schemeif you are interested in making a magic dice system parallel to hit dice (as I am)....

Physical: Offenseive (STR), Defensive (DEX), Integrity/Resistance(CON), whereas Mental: Offensive (CHA), Defensive (WIS), Integrity/Resistance (INT).

A wizard could have a d4 hit die & a d10 magic die per level, for example.

 

[R.T.]

Re: Hit Dice plus Magic Dice?

If you are looking for universal "magic" points--points that all creatures (or magic users) have regardless of their magical tradition--consider basing them on Intelligence. I like using Int because then you have a symmetrical physical/mental schemeif you are interested in making a magic dice system parallel to hit dice (as I am)....

Physical: Offenseive (STR), Defensive (DEX), Integrity/Resistance(CON), whereas Mental: Offensive (CHA), Defensive (WIS), Integrity/Resistance (INT).

A wizard could have a d4 hit die & a d10 magic die per level, for example.

That's an interesting look at things, but it doesn't quite work out for me. Resistance seems more related to Willpower, which would make Wisdom the relevant ability. In fact, this adds a third possibility to determine mana:

CON - Life Force
WIS - Willpower
CHA - Force of Personality

 

[R.T.]

There is no reason that you can't use both. Perhaps CON provides a character's begining mana points, but CHA represents the refined use of the character's life force. Basically, CON provides a few begining mana points, but CHA adds mana per level.

Nice suggestion, but I prefer limiting it to one ability.

 

[AdamBank]

Re: Re: Hit Dice plus Magic Dice?

Resistance seems more related to Willpower, which would make Wisdom the relevant ability.

I know what you mean; CoC d20 works that way with Sanity. If you are looking for an excuse to base magic points on Int, think of them as "brainpower" and rent the movie Scanners. Making Int the base for "pyschic hp" works great for alternative psionic rules (at negative 10 psi-hp your head explodes, for example ).

 

[R.T.]

Well, the Wisdom - Willpower thing is kind of getting really appealing to me. Being in tune with your surroundings sure helps. The thing about Charisma that always bugged me is that it makes sorcerers, well, charismatic. It's as if an introvert/ugly/whatever person could never use this type of magic.