SRD Additions

[Upper_Krust]

Hi guys!

Hmmm... Andy Collins said he wasn't sure about ELH on his page, and that the addition of the PsiHB was driven by demand. That said, I hope Anthony's statement indicates that it will, indeed, be added to the SRD, as it really needs to be.

I would imagine that both D&Dg and the ELH will comfortably outsell the Psionics Handbook.

Products like Legions of Hell skipped powerful entities because of lack of ELH.

I anticipate the Book of Vile Darkness to be more of a yard stick in this respect.

Though I know Erik Mona mentioned there was no point statting their Demon Lords (from AotA) without the ELH since they wouldn't be powerful enough to challenge Epic PCs - which is a bit silly since all power is relative; though I think I understand the point he was trying to make.

Not sure where it stands now, but I had heard that both DDG (excepting the D&D pantheon) and the ELH will be in the SRD at some point in the near future.

Fingers crossed!

By the way Scott mate (while I'm here); whats the street date for Tome of Horrors !?

 

[Grazzt]

By the way Scott mate (while I'm here); whats the street date for Tome of Horrors !?

November 2002. A solid street date isn't set, but it is in November for sure. I have seen some of the art prints for the book (as they are coming in)....most impressive. Hopefully I can persuade Clark to post a few as teasers.

 

[Umbran]

Though I know Erik Mona mentioned there was no point statting their Demon Lords (from AotA) without the ELH since they wouldn't be powerful enough to challenge Epic PCs - which is a bit silly since all power is relative; though I think I understand the point he was trying to make.

I think the point he's trying to makewith that is very simple - the Demon Lords should be challenges for Epic characters. But, you can't really make them such until you know what epic characters can do. How could you reliably put a CR over 28 (theoretically, the highest a non-epic character should face) on a critter without the ELH?

 

[kreynolds]

which is a bit silly since all power is relative

This kind of thinking is what led to the rediculous notations within 2nd edition products (maybe earlier) regarding big NPCs like Elminster and Drizzt. The passages looked something like this, "Elminster is always 10 levels higher than the highest level character in the party.", or something stupid like this, "Drizzt is always 10 levels higher than the highest level character in the party and always wins initiative."

No innovation or creativity.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hi Scott mate!

November 2002. A solid street date isn't set, but it is in November for sure. I have seen some of the art prints for the book (as they are coming in)....most impressive. Hopefully I can persuade Clark to post a few as teasers.

Cheers mate! Looking forward to it!

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hi Umbran matey!

I think the point he's trying to make with that is very simple - the Demon Lords should be challenges for Epic characters.

I agree.

But, you can't really make them such until you know what epic characters can do.

Firstly, yes you could. Secondly, Erik Mona was almost certainly privy to the level of power in the ELH long before that books release.

How could you reliably put a CR over 28 (theoretically, the highest a non-epic character should face) on a critter without the ELH?

Well I could.

You might want to read my Challenge Ratings article in Asgard #6.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hi kreynolds!

This kind of thinking is what led to the rediculous notations within 2nd edition products (maybe earlier) regarding big NPCs like Elminster and Drizzt.

I think you are misconstruing my ideas mate!

The passages looked something like this, "Elminster is always 10 levels higher than the highest level character in the party.", or something stupid like this, "Drizzt is always 10 levels higher than the highest level character in the party and always wins initiative."

Not exactly what I was advocating. I agree the above is ludicrous.

I was thinking more along the lines of higher Challenge Rating opponents.

No innovation or creativity.

That is often the bane of high level campaigns.

 

[CRGreathouse]

You might want to read my Challenge Ratings article in Asgard #6.

Yes, but the CRs in your article match neither the Epic Level Handbook's CRs nor (from what we've seen) the ECLs from Savage Species.

 

[Lady Dragon]

As I stated in another thread The Epic level handbook,more than any other book needs to be added top the SRD and made open content.If it is not it will join Dragon Kings(Dark Sun) and DM options:High LevelCampaigns as interesting for a month books but then quickly forgotten.

The problem with High(Epic) campaigns is not that they can't be a great experience its that most DM's don't know how to do it properly(and I certainly count myself among that number).In a low level campaign all a DM has to do is think up a mystery for the players to solve and/or stock up a dungeon they designed on graph paper.But in high and epic level campaign the players have access to spells that make overcoming low-level obsticles easy.Divination spells to solve the mystery,Travel-related spells to get right to the main villian thus skipping the rest of the dungeon/adventure.Many DM then try to take those abilities away from the players then with certain artificial obsticles thus making it a low level adventure with high(epic) level monsters.So after a few tries the group decides why bother and starts over with new characters.

So basically what I'm saying is The Epic level Handbook without a steady supply of Epic level adventures and More Epic crunch especially spells and monsters quickly will become an obsolete book forgotten just like its predessors.

I think the greatest thing that could happen for Epic level play would if WoTC brought back Planescape(Or something like it)To be an Epic Playground so to speak.But it would need more than just the inner and outer planes that we are used to but alterante realities such as that Nightmare realm that is referenced in the ELH or a more detailed City of Union.

Just Imagine a campaign setting where your characters don't save towns or worlds but universes.A place where they consult with Deities like they might consult with a town mayor.But this isn't really possible unless this book gets some real support from both WoTC and Third party companies.

And since WoTC has made it clear that the only real support they will give it is an occasional reference in some of there upcoming books it becomes vital that it be added to the SRD ASAP.

They added Psionics handbook, and I do appreciate it,but this is a book that can be used with many exisiting products since it basically just introduced two new core classes that can be added to the other eleven. But there is nothing out there that can be used with ELH it is standing out there own its own.

As for D&Dg yes it would also be nice if this were added as well especially the stat block and the rules for pantheon creation and Divine abilities.And while there at it,they might as well add the non-greyhawk pantheons since they are public domain anyhow.

I would also like to see parts of MotP added especially the rules material and the Basic D&D Cosmology.No I'm not talking about specific places like Sigil but rather just the basic planes and there circular arrangement as well as there names so that third party companies could get there cosmologies in line with D&D a little better.After all these are supposedly infinite planes so there could be a lot going on that don't effect each other.

 

[BiggusGeekus]

I mostly agree Lady Dragon.

But, in fairness, WotC should take some time to release a few "official" epic-level products to take advantage of their own license.

I'd be happy if the ELH made the SRD by early 2003.