SRD Spinoff Possibility?

[Sixchan]

But WotC aren't stupid. They know that if they do a revision every year or two people will stop buying. R3e won't make products completely unusable, it just might mean that people have to spend half an hour tops fixing stuff. At most, there will be one more revision in three or four years before the release of 4e in 2010 or thereabouts. So even if 2R3e renders older products unusable, it would be for the last time.

A new Edition evey ten years suits me fine, and I don't mind a revision or two in the meantime, ESPECIALLY not when the revisions are free.

 

[RaynerApe]

Well having a second revision between 2003 and 2010 would mean one set of corebooks per three years (2000, 2003, 2006, 2009/10). Also, they are not only planning to revise things such as minor clarifications, they are rebalancing the game. When the game is serious rebalanced, this can affect also third-party material. You never know for example, how your published adventures, monsterbooks and so on would fare in 3.0 and 3.5 considering the change of power. Another "what if" can be a comparison with the constant rebalancing of MtG where each expansion changes the scale balance between the powers.

 

[Sixchan]

Well having a second revision between 2003 and 2010 would mean one set of corebooks per three years (2000, 2003, 2006, 2009/10). Also, they are not only planning to revise things such as minor clarifications, they are rebalancing the game. When the game is serious rebalanced, this can affect also third-party material. You never know for example, how your published adventures, monsterbooks and so on would fare in 3.0 and 3.5 considering the change of power. Another "what if" can be a comparison with the constant rebalancing of MtG where each expansion changes the scale balance between the powers.

I wouldn't say "Rebalancing" so much as simply "Balancing", since if everything was balanced, there'd be no need for a revision, no?

And even still, it's not really a "Serious rebalancing". Okay, some spells are being changed, certain classes are being redone, but this isn't 4e! Some stuff may be affected, but I'd doubt if the changes from 3e to R3e made any sourcebook or module or whatever unusable.

 

[Alzrius]

So, in order to avoid such possible aggressive approach from WotC, is it possible for a collaboration between several major d20 publishers to come up with a SRD spinoff - a variant PHB/DMG/MM combo, such as Everquest and Arcana Unearthed - and then continue developing material for it instead going for the (possibly) self-destructive market of d20.

In order to be considered a "spin-off" of the SRD, it would still have to be considered compatible.

The thing to consider is that even if WotC were forced to scrap D&D by Hasbro, d20 itself would remain unchanged. The OGL and SRD would stiff be out there, as would the fan-base, and so would the dozens of d20 companies making products to feed those fans - companies that do not answer to Hasbro.

That said, several such d20-compatible SRDs already exist under the OGL. The most obvious one being the d20 Modern SRD. Likewise, Guardians of Order will be releasing a Big Eyes Small Mouth d20 SRD in just under two weeks.

IIRC, some other company release an SRD that was non-d20-compatible a little while ago. I can't remember what the company or the system was, however.

The only thing I can think of that would be as catastrophic as you talk about is if Hasbro completely folded WotC as a company, and in doing so completely dismantled the OGL (which I think, but am not certain, they could do, since Hasbro owns WotC who owns the OGL and the two SRDs).

Instead standing the chance to work with the huge market of D&D and face constant authorative changes, the already powerful d20 Market could become independant with it's own core rule book - which won't be d20 of course - but get powerful support and the knowledge that behind that corebook there isn't some corporative force requiring constant changes.

You seem to be contradicting yourself, here. There is no way that the market of d20 companies could appeal to their fan-base by publishing a Core Rulbeook that was "d20 but won't be d20".

Likewise, I don't believe even Hasbro is stupid enough to alienate their own customers by forcing constant revisions down the pipe, since they must have seen that that will anger and drive off more customers in the long-term than it will garner in immediate sales. If the current opinion is correct, the "3.5E experiment" (which we know was prompted by economics, not by a massive community outcry), has not proven that this sort of revision is a good thing if repeated.

 

[Sixchan]

Re: Re: SRD Spinoff Possibility?

Likewise, Guardians of Order will be releasing a Big Eyes Small Mouth d20 SRD in just under two weeks.

They will?

Truly, there is a god.

 

[storyguide3]

Re: Re: SRD Spinoff Possibility?

The only thing I can think of that would be as catastrophic as you talk about is if Hasbro completely folded WotC as a company, and in doing so completely dismantled the OGL (which I think, but am not certain, they could do, since Hasbro owns WotC who owns the OGL and the two SRDs).

Have no fear. Although Hasbro/WotC could terminate the d20 Trademark license, the OGL is basically forwver. The SRDs were released under the OGL and that cat is out of the bag for good.

 

[Alzrius]

Re: Re: Re: SRD Spinoff Possibility?

They will?

Yep, read all about it here: http://enworld.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=3145 I meant to link to this before, but forgot. Sorry.

Originally posted by storyguide3
Have no fear. Although Hasbro/WotC could terminate the d20 Trademark license, the OGL is basically forwver. The SRDs were released under the OGL and that cat is out of the bag for good.

Thanks for the confirmation on that - I never did understand very well how business practices worked.

 

[bret]

Actually, I could see a spinoff. Just not in the way you've described it.

I could see a 3.1 spinoff, taking the 3.0 SRD and selected material from 3.5 so that it is only the real fixs and clarifications, not the other miscellaneous changes.

• The classes (including Ranger and Monk) would stay as is.
• Harm and Heal get changed to their 3.5 revision.
• The Finesse feat uses the 3.5 revision.
• Rules clarifications are used.
• Magic items now list their strength and type.
• Consider the renamed skills for Pick Pockets (Slight of Hand) and Wilderness Lore (Survival).

Make minimal changes to the 3.0 rules in order to improve it, without causing the major changes that I see in 3.5 revision.

Things that in my opinion definately would not make the cut:

• DR changes
• Getting rid of a class of critter (Magical Beasts)
• Changes to the skills list such as removing exclusive skills and removing skills. Don't want characters to redo their skills list.
• Changes to Dwarven and Gnome racial templates.
• Changes to wizard specialization.

Things I would put as a maybe:

• Changes to the Haste spell. I probably wouldn't make them, simply because it would be too disruptive to continuity. I think this decision would be one of the toughest.
• Changes to half-elf racial template. Doesn't really hurt anything, and many people do think that half-elves need some sort of boost.
• Changes to Rogue weapon proficiencies. I' ve always felt that rogues should have Simple Weapons proficiency, but still I can see how this might disrupt continuity. I know that many of my Rogues would have taken Spiked Guantlets, Spears, and Slings depending on the circumstance.
• Giving Halfings their bonus with Slings.
• Give the Paladin additional smites as they advance in level. Once a day just isn't much of a bonus.
• Allow spell swapping for Bards and Sorcerers.
• Reduced scribing costs for wizards.

The thing would be to try and make it so the changes really are backwards compatible, to the extent where people don't have to redesign their characters when switching. Include the clarifications and fix the most broken parts of the system without unduly affecting existing characters.

 

[dcollins]

Well put, bret.

 

[Ranger REG]

Re: Re: SRD Spinoff Possibility?

That said, several such d20-compatible SRDs already exist under the OGL. The most obvious one being the d20 Modern SRD. Likewise, Guardians of Order will be releasing a Big Eyes Small Mouth d20 SRD in just under two weeks.

Actually, this is the first SRD clone by a non-WotC publisher to be made public. One can hope that others follow suit but it is left entirely up to the publishers.

IIRC, some other company release an SRD that was non-d20-compatible a little while ago. I can't remember what the company or the system was, however.

Gold Rush Games took advantage of the generic nature of the Open Game License and release their d6-based Action! System under that license, with an Action! System Trademark License to release soon.