Brother Shatterstone
Dark Moderator of PbP
Oh and the same holds true for Star Wars d20… I want books not web articles.Brother Shatterstone said:
Star Wars d20 is dead
- Thread starter Belen
- Start date
mhacdebhandia
Explorer
You've got the right to say whatever you want - but you do say it an awful lot.Ranger REG said:
Plus it's kind of churlish to stamp your feet about Wizards ignoring Kara-Tur and Greyhawk and then threadcrap in the Complete Psionics discussion over at the Wizards board with your disapproval of other fans of other elements of D&D getting what they want.
wingsandsword
Legend
As long as we're sharing anecdotal evidence about the success and spread of d6 Star Wars:
d6 Star Wars was my first RPG, it's what got me into gaming. I discovered it through references to it's source material in other Star Wars books, and started playing it because it wasn't D&D (my father having banned me from the game because he heard it was satanic). I started a d6 Star Wars campaign which at it's peak had 8 PC's, and just about everybody in the gaming club was in for at least a little while. Among all the gamers I knew, it easily was the #3 game in all of gaming, behind D&D and Vampire (and was giving Vampire a run for it's money sometimes) and just ahead of DeadLands and GURPS. People I knew who literally hated RPG's created a character and played a session or two, it was somehow an incredible crossover product outside the normal gaming world.
My great campaign lasted about a year, ending shortly before Episode I came out (and played through the collapse of WEG and the loss of the license). From that point on, we played a series of one-shots, until finally the d20 game came out, and everyone I knew migrated over to it. We had piles of stuff we hand-converted (using the conversion rules in the back), and saw gaps, but we also liked the d20 rules and saw potential in this new game.
Even now, as the RPG is dormant (I won't say dead, it's weak but still loosely supported), it's still popular. I run across gaming groups who are playing it, people who talk about stats, and the newest web site update with new stats comes up in random gaming conversation always within a few days of it's posting.
Star Wars is the biggest license in gaming, and when it's fully supported a Star Wars RPG can easily be the #2 or #3 game in the entire industry. d6 or d20.
d6 Star Wars was my first RPG, it's what got me into gaming. I discovered it through references to it's source material in other Star Wars books, and started playing it because it wasn't D&D (my father having banned me from the game because he heard it was satanic). I started a d6 Star Wars campaign which at it's peak had 8 PC's, and just about everybody in the gaming club was in for at least a little while. Among all the gamers I knew, it easily was the #3 game in all of gaming, behind D&D and Vampire (and was giving Vampire a run for it's money sometimes) and just ahead of DeadLands and GURPS. People I knew who literally hated RPG's created a character and played a session or two, it was somehow an incredible crossover product outside the normal gaming world.
My great campaign lasted about a year, ending shortly before Episode I came out (and played through the collapse of WEG and the loss of the license). From that point on, we played a series of one-shots, until finally the d20 game came out, and everyone I knew migrated over to it. We had piles of stuff we hand-converted (using the conversion rules in the back), and saw gaps, but we also liked the d20 rules and saw potential in this new game.
Even now, as the RPG is dormant (I won't say dead, it's weak but still loosely supported), it's still popular. I run across gaming groups who are playing it, people who talk about stats, and the newest web site update with new stats comes up in random gaming conversation always within a few days of it's posting.
Star Wars is the biggest license in gaming, and when it's fully supported a Star Wars RPG can easily be the #2 or #3 game in the entire industry. d6 or d20.
Ranger REG
Explorer
Most likely #3, since it has to compete with Vampire, assuming we're talking about the entire RPG industry market.wingsandsword said:
As for the Complete Psionics discussion, you're right. It just that I cannot help but wonder why WotC didn't kill two birds with one stone, meaning whatever they're including in Complete Psionics should have been in XPH already. Anyhoo, I cannot help but chuckle that no matter what WotC do, for that particular series of books, it is never "complete."
trancejeremy
Adventurer
I actually do think that Star Wars was hurt by the change from d6 to d20.
Not so much the rules (though I also think that having to put a revised version of the rulebook so quick hurt), but there was just a whole shift in the feel of the game.
In a lot of ways, it's like the old Battlestar Galactica vs. the new one. Even though it's arguable the same basic story, most people prefer one or the author.
I know I have most WEG Star Wars products, but only have a couple WOTC ones. The WOTC wasn't bad, just too different in feel.
Like for instance, in the WEG Star Wars RPG, Mara Jade was almost like Drizzt, that is, godly. But in WOTC SW, she was a wuss.
But anyway, I think the real problem is just WOTC - for them, even the #3 selling RPG isn't worth the effort on their part. Especially since the license fees aren't cheap, either. And not to mention the hassle of deal with Lucasfilm for approval and all that.
Not so much the rules (though I also think that having to put a revised version of the rulebook so quick hurt), but there was just a whole shift in the feel of the game.
In a lot of ways, it's like the old Battlestar Galactica vs. the new one. Even though it's arguable the same basic story, most people prefer one or the author.
I know I have most WEG Star Wars products, but only have a couple WOTC ones. The WOTC wasn't bad, just too different in feel.
Like for instance, in the WEG Star Wars RPG, Mara Jade was almost like Drizzt, that is, godly. But in WOTC SW, she was a wuss.
But anyway, I think the real problem is just WOTC - for them, even the #3 selling RPG isn't worth the effort on their part. Especially since the license fees aren't cheap, either. And not to mention the hassle of deal with Lucasfilm for approval and all that.
Last edited:
wingsandsword
Legend
In the d6 Star Wars RPG, all the main movie and novel characters were nigh godlike, with stats no PC could reasonably expect to ever have.trancejeremy said:
Luke Skywalker, as a 19 year old farmboy who had never been offworld and lead a quite uneventful life had such a huge list of skills that even characters created by-the-book and played weekly for a year wouldn't have anywhere near as much power. This was always held up as a weakness of d6, that they made even the weak movie characters far more powerful than PC's could ever hope to be. Palpatine, for example, had 40 force points, 15D or more in all force skills, and 21 skills at more than 10D in value. PC's on the other hand, would be doing well to ever get one skill that high, focusing on it for an entire campaign.
More experienced main characters; Mara Jade, Grand Admiral Thrawn, Darth Vader, Chewbacca, Han Solo, or heavens help you, the Emperor himself, had stats that would take many years of constant play to get near.
Ranger REG
Explorer
Yeah, but at least the new BSG is not going on hiatus, now that the second season have already started.trancejeremy said:
That reminds me, I gotta go to that newly opened Best Buy store in Hawaii for the first season BSG DVD set.
Meh. Everyone who are publishing or manufacturing licensed products go through the same thing. Anyhoo, I'm not giving up on WotC until they officially have their license revoked or expired. I'm just trying to give them a proverbial kick in their arses, and if that meant they got bleeding welts from me, so be it.trancejeremy said:
The only thing WotC can pray for is that I retire from RPG hobby soon, that is if they still can't come up with a strategic plan to publish new SW RPG products soon.
mhacdebhandia
Explorer
I prefer to be charitable - both the economic limits on book length and reasonable expectations of creativity suggest that not everything that could be written for psionics could have been written and included in the Expanded Psionics Handbook.Ranger REG said:
If nothing else, the Expanded Psionics Handbook probably wasn't designed to include psionic material for non-psionic classes.
Ranger REG
Explorer
"Psionic material for non-psionic classes." Heh. Like Complete Divine and Complete Arcane have provide material for non-spellcasting classes. I'd be interested to see what a fighter PC can benefit from Complete Psionic.mhacdebhandia said:
Kanegrundar
Explorer
So the XPH should have been the one and final psionics book? After that, there should be no more tooling around with it? Just like the PHB was the final word on dwarves, fighters, elves, wizards, feats, skills, and so forth. Why can't psionics be expanded upon like everything else?
Kane
Kane
Similar Threads
