Star Wars prequel questions

[R_J_K75]

99% of our childhood toys got destroyed in a fire. Some of my stuff was with me and survives to this day -save for some pieces I sold for pennies in a toy flea market-.

I sold all my toys about 1994. I sold them pretty cheap too. I regretted it, but my basement got flooded in 1997 so in the long run they'd have been destroyed so I guess all is right with the world.

 

[jian]

The problem is, the arc they gave Han in Solo means the rough, tough scoundrel we met in Star Wars who reluctantly fell in with the good guys, gave up smuggling, and eventually became heroic never existed. He was always a hero fighting for the for the downtrodden, always saw the good in people, and always gave up his fortune for the greater good. Talk about not being allowed to evolve.

Also, we've always had to live with the fact that his relationship with Leia was confrontational (the fact that the two weren't an item in TFA was a good way of dealing with that). But then you watch Solo and realize that Leia was the only woman he treated like that. It changes the romance arc in ESB from being the love that helped him lower his guard and let someone in to the story of Han really getting into his emotionally abusive relationship era.

Honestly, I don’t really see that. Han in Solo is much the same guy as he is in Star Wars and in the various prequel books I’m old enough to remember - an outlaw who’s mostly out for himself and people he cares about (which, in SW, is basically just Chewie) but is also a decent human being, albeit one putting on a tough facade and who has to deal with the Galaxy the way it is, not the way he wants it to be. He’s no Rebel until SW, but that doesn’t make him a bad person and doesn’t preclude him being a good one. He didn’t need the other PCs to teach him basic morality.

In SW Han basically has no relationship with these idiots and just wants to get paid (and Ben for one is totally fine with this, he’s not going to make him a recruitment pitch, but does trust him enough to reveal that he’s a Jedi, which is kind of a big deal when you think about it). Once said idiots have got him in way more trouble than he’d like, he’s just making it up as he goes along. Once he gets paid, he’s very conflicted about whether to join their hopeless cause (probability of getting killed: about 30% per year) or not, and again that doesn’t make him a bad or amoral person.

His relationship with Leia is different, and much of it is simply the difference in gender politics between 1978 and 2018. Mostly I think Leia just pisses him off roughly 60% of the time on a personal level but he’s also very attracted to her and knows that she’s very attracted to him, and that neither of them really know what to do about it. Honestly, I don’t think their getting married was a good idea, but these things happen in war.

 

[Maxperson]

The problem is, the arc they gave Han in Solo means the rough, tough scoundrel we met in Star Wars who reluctantly fell in with the good guys, gave up smuggling, and eventually became heroic never existed. He was always a hero fighting for the for the downtrodden, always saw the good in people, and always gave up his fortune for the greater good. Talk about not being allowed to evolve.

Also, we've always had to live with the fact that his relationship with Leia was confrontational (the fact that the two weren't an item in TFA was a good way of dealing with that). But then you watch Solo and realize that Leia was the only woman he treated like that. It changes the romance arc in ESB from being the love that helped him lower his guard and let someone in to the story of Han really getting into his emotionally abusive relationship era.

I don't agree with this. In Solo we see him betrayed by the woman he loves. That sort of thing causes scars and in a lot of men ends up causing them to react in ways that push women away, which is what we see in the original Star Wars movies. It can also cause bitterness and push people to be out for themselves instead of others, which is also what we see in the original Star Wars movies.

Han being human neatly solves both of the issues you have above.

 

[Zardnaar]

I don't agree with this. In Solo we see him betrayed by the woman he loves. That sort of thing causes scars and in a lot of men ends up causing them to react in ways that push women away, which is what we see in the original Star Wars movies. It can also cause bitterness and push people to be out for themselves instead of others, which is also what we see in the original Star Wars movies.

Han being human neatly solves both of the issues you have above.

Me (21F) have met an older guy (M38). We come from very different backgrounds. Im from a nice upper class family dad treats me like royalty. He is a military drop out, works in logistics with unreliable hours. Hes not adverse to breaking the law either. Rough background.

I think I like him but theres a cute 21M as well. Ive more or less friend zoned him as he's more like a brother. M38 spends all his time in logistics with his best mate. I'm not 100% sure he's straight.

I've met another friend of his. Claims to be in local government but gives off major fake vibes and can be a bit creepy. I dont trust him either. Wondering about potential red flags.

I don't want to lead him on. AitAH?

 

[R_J_K75]

I am skeptical that Lord and Miller produced something bad. They have an excellent track record. I think it's more likely that it was a little too crazy for Lucasfilm, which is a pretty conservative and nervous organization.

I'm not sure I ever read what the problems were with the first directors other than creative differences. I'm not too familiar with their work but looking at their Wikipedia page I've seen a good portion of their work which was good. So, I think you are right.

 

[Deset Gled]

He’s no Rebel until SW, but that doesn’t make him a bad person and doesn’t preclude him being a good one. He didn’t need the other PCs to teach him basic morality.

Han shot first. Han refused to save Leia without a reward. Han took valuable resources from the rebels and left before the battle of Yavin. Han was a bad person. That's why him returning to save a Luke at the Death Star was a major turning point in his arc.

That sort of thing causes scars and in a lot of men ends up causing them to react in ways that push women away, which is what we see in the original Star Wars movies. It can also cause bitterness and push people to be out for themselves instead of others, which is also what we see in the original Star Wars movies.

Well, yeah. And if the movie about Han had shown that we wouldn't be having this discussion. Instead we got the story of Han giving up all his reward to fund the Rebellion and still wanting to do right by Qira.

 

[jian]

Han shot first. Han refused to save Leia without a reward. Han took valuable resources from the rebels and left before the battle of Yavin. Yes, Han was a bad person. That's why him returning to save a Luke at the Death Star was a major turning point in his arc.

Shooting first (against someone who has the drop on you and is either gonna kill you now or take you to someone who is) doesn’t make you immoral. Taking a freely proffered reward for services rendered doesn’t either; he hadn’t blackmailed the Rebellion into promising him cash beforehand. Han owes the Rebellion nothing at this point.

So no, I would strongly argue Han isn’t a bad person in SW. He’s quite human and realistic, and behaves consistently with a person who has basic morality but doesn’t want to die or rot in Imperial prison.

 

[Dioltach]

Shooting first (against someone who has the drop on you and is either gonna kill you now or take you to someone who is) doesn’t make you immoral.

 

[Morrus]

Shooting first (against someone who has the drop on you and is either gonna kill you now or take you to someone who is) doesn’t make you immoral. Taking a freely proffered reward for services rendered doesn’t either; he hadn’t blackmailed the Rebellion into promising him cash beforehand. Han owes the Rebellion nothing at this point.

So no, I would strongly argue Han isn’t a bad person in SW. He’s quite human and realistic, and behaves consistently with a person who has basic morality but doesn’t want to die or rot in Imperial prison.

Well, the arc isn't "baddie->goodie" it's "scoundrel->hero". He certainly starts as a selfish person. Whether that's bad or not in your eyes is up to you, I guess, but that's clearly his character arc in ANH.

 

[HeroineIs]

I rewatched the prequels recently and had the same reaction. They’re not great, but they’re not unwatchable either. The CGI aged badly, the logic is shaky, but Revenge of the Sith still works for me as a movie.