Station Squatting (Player Railroading)

[Teflon Billy]

Except that for every time a general changed history a merchant did the same.
It was a slave who challenged the roman empire, it was a merchant guild which shaped the political landscape of northern europe for years and it was not faith which made popes, but the bribes of merchants.
And even when generals did act, their actions were often spurred by what the merchants desire.

...and yet somehow, the myths we've built up, and the legends we tell each other aren't about shopkeepers.

It's a damn mystery I tell you.

 

[SHARK]

Greetings!

Ahhh. And it was Roman Generals and Roman Legions that crushed the slave that dared to raise his fist in rebellion to Rome.

It was Kings and ferocious, cunning nobles--and their armies of troops and assassins--that crushed the Hanseatic League, and put the merchants on notice who held the real power.

Just sayin'

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

 

[The Green Adam]

Except that for every time a general changed history a merchant did the same.
It was a slave who challenged the roman empire, it was a merchant guild which shaped the political landscape of northern europe for years and it was not faith which made popes, but the bribes of merchants.
And even when generals did act, their actions were often spurred by what the merchants desire.

And the children of farmer's lead the French Army against England, became princes, traveled to Oz and destroyed the Death Star. Heh, sorta.

AD

 

[Krensky]

My entire point was that I think the situation with players wanting to open the bakery is better handled out of game than in game. When you attempt to handle it in game generally no one ends up being happy. The players in this situation are apparently unwilling to play ball*, and no amount of burning bakeries down will make them want to play ball*. At this point, it's best to explain that you don't want to run the type of game they want to play. They can either play ball*, part amicably, or you can do something else.

You misunderstood. Or I said it wrong. Or both.

Anyway. In general, the let's open a bakery and adventure for flour would bring the game to a screeching pause while I look at them slightly confused and ask if they really want to do that. My player know, and have informed new players, that this is a subtle way of telling them they're about to do something stupid. It's get used when someone picks up a butter knife at a state dinner and states his intention to stab the King to death with it. If that failed I'd explain either in game like in Billy's example, or stop the game entirely if needed to reiterate what was in the campaign write up and record sheets, and remind them of all of the threads they will have to drop to pursue a full time career as a baker. Failing that, I might give having the city sacked when the villain of that game got around to it, or I might just tell them they retire and detail what happens with their plot threads, the main plot, and the world. This may result in some other group of heroes saving the world, or the world may end. I'd have to make up my mind if it ever occurred.

 

[Desdichado]

I think we're probably all closer together than this thread makes us appear, in terms of how we run. By arguing this point, I'm not in any way saying that I would enjoy a game of fantasy bakery. I wouldn't at all. I'd pack up and leave such a game.

I just don't like the idea that the OP seemed to be strongly implying of "I'll treat passive aggressive players with passive aggressive DMing! That'll larn 'em!"

No, it probably won't.

 

[The Green Adam]

I just don't like the idea that the OP seemed to be strongly implying of "I'll treat passive aggressive players with passive aggressive DMing! That'll larn 'em!"

No, it probably won't.

This is my view in a nutshell. "If you guys are gonna jerk around I'm gonna jerk around more better!" Weee!

I think I differ from most however in the fact that I would accept the unspoken challenge of the players. If they think that spending this session shopping or selling stuff would be fun, I'm going to find a way to make shopping and selling stuff highly entertaining, not just for them but for me as well.

When players see a map to the dungeon and point to a spot waaay off to the left in the countryside and say "Hmm, what's over here?" I don't get upset or say they can't go or tell them to focus on the dungeon/adventure I created. I say, "Gee, not sure...haven't been over there in a while. Wanna go check it out?"

AD

 

[Alikar]

I just don't like the idea that the OP seemed to be strongly implying of "I'll treat passive aggressive players with passive aggressive DMing! That'll larn 'em!"

No, it probably won't.

Huh? No I would just kindly ask them to get back to adventuring, if they didn't I'd ask them to leave for the rest of the parties sake. Not sure where your getting this strange idea from, but then again seeing how you've implied how I DM in other posts, without ever having played with me, its not surprising.

 

[Desdichado]

Huh? No I would just kindly ask them to get back to adventuring, if they didn't I'd ask them to leave for the rest of the parties sake. Not sure where your getting this strange idea from, but then again seeing how you've implied how I DM in other posts, without ever having played with me, its not surprising.

Your ability to play ignorant of the content of your past posts is rather remarkable. I got the idea from all the things you've said in this thread.

Or, to paraphrase, "Don't act so surprised, your Highness. You weren't on any mercy mission this time."

 

[roguerouge]

An Academic Historian (whose name eludes me at the moment) said it best...I'm paraphrasing but it was essentially "History is about what the kings, Popes, Generals movers and Shakers were doing...no one cares what the peasants were up to and no one should. Here's your answer: Subsistence Farming and trying not to die"

I agree with him.

Except that for every time a general changed history a merchant did the same.

It was a slave who challenged the roman empire, it was a merchant guild which shaped the political landscape of northern europe for years and it was not faith which made popes, but the bribes of merchants.

And even when generals did act, their actions were often spurred by what the merchants desire.

...and yet somehow, the myths we've built up, and the legends we tell each other aren't about shopkeepers.

It's a damn mystery I tell you.

That's a bad historian, really stuck into the fairly simplistic Great Man Theory (see: Great man theory - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia). I can understand why you and I find it more appealing than things like resource discoveries, population fluctuations, ideologies, environmental damage, and social and economic structures... which is the context that shape, influence, and often determine the decisions these great men make.