Stopping take 20 Searching.

[Psychic Warrior]

Just don't allow it. Make them roll. What's the problem? Making all the players roll will take up more real time so I don't bother with it but if that is what you want - go ahead.

reanjr - the first time your fighter went wandering off by himself I would ensure the rest of the party left promptly after him - in the opposite direction (probably through the secret door I just found).

 

[reanjr]

I don't see the problem. Maybe if they do it in the middle of clearing the dungeon it might be a bit stupid. But after the dungeon or area is cleared, a thorough search might be in order. Heck, the PCs probably have risked their lives in the process, so searching to make sure they haven't missed any loot is just wise!

I'm generally cool with searching the dungeon afterwards, as well. But the players who stop after all the creatures are cleared in a room are what irk me.

 

[Klaus]

Count me in the "I don't see the problem here" crowd.

4 people taking 2 minutes to ascertain if there's anything useful/valuable/dangerous in a 10x10 area isn't farfetched/metagamey at all. 2 minutes *fly by*. I certainly wouldn't want to storm inside an underground environment and leave uncharted territory at my back. That's a poor tactical decision, as danger not always lies ahead.

 

[reanjr]

reanjr - the first time your fighter went wandering off by himself I would ensure the rest of the party left promptly after him - in the opposite direction (probably through the secret door I just found).

I can always take off and find a new group of adventurers who aren't so dull to adventure with. I have no problem running if I find something bad.

 

[reanjr]

Count me in the "I don't see the problem here" crowd.

4 people taking 2 minutes to ascertain if there's anything useful/valuable/dangerous in a 10x10 area isn't farfetched/metagamey at all. 2 minutes *fly by*. I certainly wouldn't want to storm inside an underground environment and leave uncharted territory at my back. That's a poor tactical decision, as danger not always lies ahead.

It becomes metagaming when it is done in every single room. Players do it because they expect to find loot because that's the goal in D&D. To kill monsters and take the loot. When a tactical squad enters a building, they move through as quickly as possible, neutralizing any threats and ascertaining the entire situation.

Only then do they begin to search for evidence and question people.

 

[Umbran]

Hey all.
Here's my problem: On every dungeon crawl, every time my group of PCs clears a room, they take 20 on the Search checks... With a typical party of 5, spreadout in a standard room, this doesn't take much time at all.

Well, remember that it takes 1 round to search a 5'x5' square. There are four of those per 10'x10' square. Takeing 20 uses twenty times as much time as a normal check. So, a 10'x10' square takes 80 rounds (8 minutes - thanks for the catch S'mon!) to search in this manner. When there's nothing going on, this isn't much time per square, no. But it's eternity if you're working on a round-by-round timescale.

Simple, realistic things to happen in that time? Simple - combat generally isn't silent. It is actually quite loud. So, if a fight happens in a given room, and the party stops to search, the critters in the next room have time to come and investigate, or to make ready.

Tactical situations can change enormously when the opponent has time to get ready. You don't catch them flatfooted, they get a chance to take advantage of terrain, set up ambushes aroudn corners. Taking time to search while there's still active enemies about can and should be a tactical blunder. Imagine what happens if word spreads among dungeon inhabitants (80 rounds is a lot of moves and speaking free actions), so that the party has to fight all of them at once, rather than piecemeal!

 

[Dracomeander]

Remember: finding traps easy, disarming traps hard.

The group I'm currently in would disagree with this. As long as it is a mechanical trap, my psion (kineticist) has no problem disabling it. However, the characters with trapfinding abilities have abysmally low Search skill modifiers, so we get hit by 2/3rds or more of the traps before we find them.

 

[Jeff Wilder]

I have no problem with allowing searchers to Take 20. I don't get the tedium thing, since (as folks have said) it's just a matter of 10 seconds of description of what they find (or not). I'd be more able to understand if the complaint was that Taking 20 on searches robs the game of some flavor, since nobody searches the bed, or the altar, or so on anymore. I'd also more easily understand if the complaint was that it makes searching too easy and certain.

The fix is related for both of those. Simply assume that whomever hid the item (if deliberately hidden) took as much care hiding it as searchers are taking looking for it, and set the DC high to reflect that. You can then grant a search bonus, if you wish, for searching in specific places.

Note, however, that this will slow down searching. If "tedium" really is the complaint, you won't wanna do that.

 

[S'mon]

Umbran - 80 rounds is 8 minutes; ie it's 2 minutes to search 1 square, 8 minutes to search a 10x10 area. For a party of 6 searching a large cavern I'd normally just say "OK, 30 minutes later..." and likely use the PC w the highest Search skill's skill to see what was found. I might roll a random encounter & any nearby monsters will have had plenty of time to prepare their defenses.

 

[Lhorgrim]

My suggestion is let your players know that this is how you feel.

Many players become paranoid about searching the bottom of every outhouse because some previous adventure hid something very valuable, or integral to the completion of the adventure.

I have played in games in the past where we managed to complete the adventure and then the DM read off the list of goodies we missed and where they were hidden. I have missed treasure that was hidden in haystacks, buried under the dungheap behind a barn, and hidden inside statues. These kinds of adventures motivated my group to "take the place apart piece by piece" to find whatever was there.

If your players learn that they can rely on their own judgement on what to search that is probably what they will start to do. If they continue to do the survey search of every room you can take some of the excellent advice in this thread to motivate them to move on.