Strategy Help Needed (Torm please don't read)

[Henry]

I would have called this "The Trees Have Eyes!" but that might have given it away.

Our PC Party has been asked to stop a full-scale logging operation by Thayan loggers looking to lay a forest flat for unknown reasons (profit, or maybe something buried inside, we don't know yet). One suggestion, is to contact the services of a mid-level Druid, and offer him services or ridiculous amounts of money to Awaken twenty or so trees, and use them to wreak bloody hell on the Thayans' advances. We are not yet in the season they plan to start logging (we still have a few months left). The questions I have are:

1) Assuming said druid has the XP to blow, would he be willing to engage in such widespread ecological change to a forest for the sake of saving it?

2) Assuming gargantuan or colossal animated objects, would it be worth our time to do so? ten of these things are an EL of roughly 11 to 14, and twenty would only raise it to EL 14 to 18 or so. (Depending on how many colossal and how many gargantuan). Compare this to a corps of a few hundred thayan troops, and backed up by Wizards and summoned beasties.

I'm thinking the idea is just not feasable, and would be worthless, especially since their AC is so low, even if they had some spectacular melee capability.

Any better suggestions for fending off a few hundred troops in a forest when you don't yet know the true size and strength of the enemy, but have a pretty good idea?

 

[diaglo]

rule 1: Know thy enemy. the key to any battle is always setting the stage. knowing where your enemy will act, how they will act, their strengths and weaknesses. you pick the when and where.


why are thayan wizards logging a forest? sounds more like something the sembians would do.

are there elves, fey, or other woodland creatures in the area? spread the word.

what are acceptable losses?

 

[Shallown]

The idea has merit if you use guerilla tactics versus staright on war. Have the awakened trees attack without warning wiping out small groups of soldiers and targeting the wizards who should stand out well enough if they are part of a military organization. There is also the chance to awaken some protector animals such as a dire bear or two who would remain to protect the forest once you leave.

The hardest part of defending a place like that for adventurers is that to truley protect it you have to remain there or create a system that will be self sustaining.

Also the whole guerilla tactics makes it more fun as players since more strategy and psychological warfare is involved and it also keeps the gm from going mad from running a large battle.

Any forest can survive some logging so allowing it to start and lul them into a sense of complacentcy may also be useful.

The spell compendium has a mass awakened but I don't remember the stats on it.

Later

 

[diaglo]

can Ents still awaken trees?

diaglo "i suck at the new rules" Ooi

 

[Geron Raveneye]

Yup, they can awaken them and control two at the same time, making them fight like a treant in all respects.

At least in 3E. Don't know about 3.5E.

 

[HeapThaumaturgist]

Treants can only animate a few trees at any one time, so not that great, though apparently the Treant's trees share its stats (as they fight "similar in all respects") other than slow slow movement.

The real key would be assasination of the wizards. If you were able to neutralize them, I think animated trees could take care of even large numbers of mooky-types with a little forethought. Animated trees have Hardness 5, giving them great protection against even massed numbers of Warrior1 creatures. If you can protect them from torches (maybe a wand of Energy Resistance?) they can just trample through whole regiments.

Awaken has an instant duration, so you can protect the trees from summons by throwing down burst Dispels, though that will hose an ER. Best bet is to lay an ambush and kill the wizards. Entangle + Readied Archers can force multiple concentration checks on wizards, though the DCs are probably low enough that high level Red Wizards won't be that bothered.

Nastier, though, would be to hit up an Evard's Tentacles, as grappling is a bit worse for casters. Even better would be Earthen Grasp or whatever that one is from Complete Arcane, as it is a lower-level spell. While not an AoE, you can take enough in a day or make a multi-use item that will let you stick a hand on every caster they have. Note that they have to have certain things at hand to cast ANY spells, and you can ready actions to have archers fire if the wizards attempt to port out.

If you're playing with any Psionics, just hire a Shaper. A few properly configured Astral Constructs can grapple a wizard into submission for even cheaper.

--fje

 

[BlackMoria]

Take the fight to them. The loggers and the protecting troops need to get to the forest. That means a good road for the logging equipment and for the wagons to haul the logs. The Thayans must get said equipment and troops into the area first. So hit them before they reach the forest.

If the route has a few chokepoints (bridges, ravines, tight terrain), these become logical ambush points.

Besides the soldiers, wizards and loggers ( the logical first targets most people consider), the following will have a impact should it be destroyed.

The animals hauling the wagons: Vulnerable to being killed or being controlled by a druid.

The wagons: Vulnerable to being destroyed or disabled in a variety of fashions or being animated.

The logging equipment: Vulnerable to being stolen, destroyed or being animated.

The road: Bridges can be destroyed, the road can be cratered, roadblocked or made into a hopeless mire of mud.


Here is how I would do it, as a example. For this example, I will use a bridge as a chokepoint.

Prior to the ambush, the bridge supports would be weaked or destroyed so that the first wagon load will collapse it or it can be rigged to collapse at the critical moment by the ambushers. The areas around the bridge but off the road is liberally seeded with caltrops, concealed spike pits and tanglefoot wire to impede movement.

The ambushers should consist of good mix of warriors and spellcasters. The ambushers are divided into two 'tasking' groups. Group A has the task of neutralizing the enemy spellcasters (first priority) and killing the soldiers (second priority). Group B has the task of destroying the logging convoy.

Now that the preparations are done, illusions or illusionary terrain can be cast to hide the prepping of the battlefield and conceal the ambushers. Once the early warning system (a druid in bird form or whatever) detects the logging convoy coming, earth elementals can be summoned and concealed beneath the road, and a water elemental or two in the water under the bridge.

The logging convoy will most likely have a vanguard of troops proceeding the wagons and a rear guard following the wagons. The bridge is a good point for the ambush because any flank scouts will have to pull into the convoy for the river crossing.

The vanguard troops are allowed to pass over the bridge. The first wagon crossing the bridge is the trigger for the ambush.

ACTION!

The bridge collapses or is made to collapse, taking the first wagon and its crew down. The water elementals finish the survivors off. The collapse of the bridge has now isolated the vanguard from the rest of the convoy,

AS the ambush party opens up (surprise round) with a hail of arrows and spells. The arrows are directed at any spellcasters and obvious leader types. Group A spell casters target the casters with spells (usually area spells to catch the spellcasters' body guards in the AoE) as well. Group B hits the convoy along the its length with fireballs - a good choice of spell because it will most likely kill the animals hauling the wagons, will kill the drovers and accompanying low level troops, and it will set the wagons on fire (wagons are hauling supplies like canvas for tenting, lamp oil, and other easy flammable objects). After the fireballs go off, the earth elementals rise out of ground and lay into anyone and everything.

Now initiative is rolled. If you have done your job well, you go into the first initiative round with the enemy force already significantly attrited (most of the low level mooks should be dead) most of the enemy spellcasters dead or heavily damaged, the vanguard and rear guard have been cut off from supporting each other, and the wagons are immoblized and on fire.

The first round is more of the same - continue pounding on the surviving spellcasters with spells and arrows. The elementals engage the surviving ground troops. The caltrops and concealed pit traps will impede the enemy forces from effectively sallying out to decisively engage your ambushers.

After the initial round is done, do an assessment. If the enemy force is severely damaged and your forces are lightly damaged, then continue and try to wipe them out. If the enemy force still has significant numbers, then get the hell out of Dodge and disengage. Your job is done....the logging equipment and wagons are destroyed and the bridge is going to have to be rebuilt to allow logging operations to continue. The caltrops, pit traps and tangle wire will inhibit a organized pursuit while you make a clean break.... and besides, the enemy still has to deal with the enraged elementals in their midst first.

If the Thayans try again, lather, rinse and repeat - always at a different location and time. At some point, they are going to have to decide if the logs is worth the cost in men and equipment.

Sidebar: This very scenario was played out by my group a few years back. They had the party members and allied rangers and druids and a contingent of elf archers for a total of 50 ambushers. The loggin convoy numbered 250, with over half of the enemy being soldiers.
Long story short - the ambushers totally destroyed the convoy and soldiers.

 

[Umbran]

1) Assuming said druid has the XP to blow, would he be willing to engage in such widespread ecological change to a forest for the sake of saving it?

We cannot answer that one, as it depends upon the NPC in particular.

2) Assuming gargantuan or colossal animated objects, would it be worth our time to do so? ten of these things are an EL of roughly 11 to 14, and twenty would only raise it to EL 14 to 18 or so. (Depending on how many colossal and how many gargantuan). Compare this to a corps of a few hundred thayan troops, and backed up by Wizards and summoned beasties.

People are always saying that high-level characters can blow through an army. I don't see why this doesn't apply here as well. Recall that the soldiers are coming to the forest - which means you get to pick the battleground and tactics. That means you get to minimize how many of those soldiers will be able to get at the awakened trees at any given time.

The soldiers are probably a non-issue, unless they're of notable level. If they're common 1st level warriors, the tree's will mow them down in pleasant irony. Wizards or clerics among the soldiers are a much larger concern.

It would seem to me that's what the party is for - the trees are your grunt infantry. The party are the special-ops ghuys who sneak aroudn and take out the artillery

 

[LostSoul]

Do you have any characters with high Bluff skills? You could try to infiltrate the enemy camp and gather information. A wizard might be a better choice, especially if you need to get away quickly. Detect Thoughts is your friend.

Once you find out who the leaders are, and if you can take them or not, go in and assassinate them. If you can't take the leaders, you're in trouble no matter what: even if you start to destroy the army, the leaders will come after you and smack you down.

 

[Henry]

Keep 'em coming; you people are fantastic.

Thoughts so far based on previous:

• awakened forest life & druids "hiding in plain sight"
• earth elementals under the ground
• try to get treant services, he hides and animates trees
• attack animals in caravans (check with paladin & friendly druids first, though)
• army of astral constructs?
• hit & fade ambushes

The attacking animals I'll have to check first - one PC is a Dryad Paladin and may object, much less any friendly druids we have.

Astral constructs are an interesting aside - earlier we were trapped in a demiplane where summoned monsters and constructs stayed around after summoning, under our control! We escaped, but if I could find a way there and back safely again (fat chance ) then I could bring an army with me.

Do you have any characters with high Bluff skills? You could try to infiltrate the enemy camp and gather information.

I am playing a Telepath with maxxed out social skills, so when the time comes, intelligence gathering won't necessarily be a problem.