#### DeDiceManCometh

##### Explorer

Triple 7s = crit, Triple 0s = fumble (I kinda like the implied nomenclature: "7s UP" and "Zeroed Out")

Would this create extreme problems?

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- Thread starter DeDiceManCometh
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Triple 7s = crit, Triple 0s = fumble (I kinda like the implied nomenclature: "7s UP" and "Zeroed Out")

Would this create extreme problems?

Some might consider that a good thing.

Depends on what your goals are...?Would this create extreme problems?

I've found 4d6-4 works well, personally. and gives a range of 0-20 with an average 10, and thankfully d6's with 0-5 are already out there (I own 10 of them ).

Could add to that with one 0 means something unusual happens, two 0's something bad happens, and 000 results in something terrible.

if the DC is low then succeeeding even when rolling one 0 or even 00 isn't out of the question, so this would mix things up both for success and failure.

I'm not a math person. Can you quantify

If you mean that people will hate on the "Z" notation because it decouples the number of sides on the dice while replacing it with the notion of the "max #" on the dice,... yes, I have already been incinerated with flames on that. Not on these forums, however.

With at least two 7s you are quite close to 5%. So that will work well enough if you like the idwa of a bell curve.

Triple 0s =fumble

Count me out.

For a uniform distribution like d20, +1 is always equivalent to 1/N, where N is the number of sides on the die. So long as failure remains an option, +1 is always an increase of 0.05 (5%) to the probability of success.I'm not a math person. Can you quantifyhowdrastic the difference is for a DC10 (or DC11) and a DC15 or DC20 under a bell curve like this?

For the distribution you're discussing, it would be as follows, assuming that you are using "meet or beat" rules.

DC 9: 68.38%

DC 10: 59.38%

DC 11: 50% (exactly)

DC 12: 40.63%

DC 13: 31.54%

DC 14: 23.44%

DC 15: 16.41%

....

DC 19: 1.95%

DC 20: 0.78%

So, a +1 is the same as reducing the DC by 1. That means, at the center of the bell curve, +1 is equivalent to about 9.5%, roughly double the benefit of +1 in a uniform distribution. At DC 15, +1 is equivalent to almost exactly 7%, and at DC 20, +1 is equivalent to just over 1%.

At the edges of the bell curve, modifiers become nearly worthless unless they're huge. At the center of the bell curve, modifiers have a massive swing--the difference between DC9 and DC 12 is huge. It's equivalent to going from "you succeed twice as often as you fail," which feels like "normal" difficulty to most players, over to "you fail twice as often as you succeed," which is going to feel like absolute garbage for most players. A -2 or -3 penalty when near the center of the curve is terribly punishing; a +2 or +3 when near the center of the curve means nearly guaranteed success.

Perhaps these are desirable effects for you; but you may wish to consider the impact on player psychology, as noted.

And I haven't heard the question asked yet, but it's always something you should ask yourself when considering these things: What are you trying to accomplish? Is there a "problem" you want to fix? A mechanic you don't like?

Wouldn't 3z7 make it less swingy and more predictable? Maybe I misunderstand what swingy means.

And I haven't heard the question asked yet, but it's always something you should ask yourself when considering these things: What are you trying to accomplish? Is there a "problem" you want to fix? A mechanic you don't like?

So you have a preplanned encounter, you set the DC at 15 (or you have an NPC with an AC of 15, etc). Now take the average party that has a +5 on their skill check (or attack, etc). Great, they odds of success are basically 50%. But, now you take the average party that has a feat, magic item, or some combination that gives them a +6, they now have a 59% success chance. Or if they have a +7 they suddenly have a 68% chance. Swingy.Wouldn't 3z7 make it less swingy and more predictable? Maybe I misunderstand what swingy means.

Or just look at attacks within the party. The fighter has a +7 attack against the AC15 and hits 68% of the time. But they rogue only has a +5 so he hits 50% of the time and the poor sorcerer with his +3 only hits 30% of the time. Swingy.

If you are not perfectly balanced or optimized, you suddenly are not comparable to other in your party or the encounter goes from too easy to too hard.

Yes. Ignore anyone who says otherwise.Wouldn't 3z7 make it less swingy and more predictable? Maybe I misunderstand what swingy means.

Hmm, what's that on my shoe? Did I just step in something?

You get a flatter bell curve with 2d10, and you can easily add Adv/Dis by making it 3d10 (drop the lowest or highest depending on adv or disadv).

For crits they trigger if both dice come up with 9's or 0's (4 percent chance). Champions get this buffed to 8, 9, 0 (roughly 9 percent) and then finally 7, 8, 9, 0 (16 percent)

For crits they trigger if both dice come up with 9's or 0's (4 percent chance). Champions get this buffed to 8, 9, 0 (roughly 9 percent) and then finally 7, 8, 9, 0 (16 percent)

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