D&D 5E Summoning and Binding Demons in 5E

[Gwarok]

I want to know how to proceed on summoning and binding bad guys, elementals, all that. I am the DM, so I can do anything I suppose, but I was also a HUGE fan of spells like Cacodaemon form 1st edition and always loved that aspect of the game. Sadly, as it stands now in 5e I'm not sure how this is supposed to work.

Planar Binding looked promising but has a long cast time and basically is like a longer term no concentrate Dominate spell that take awhile to cast. Ok, fine. But they suggest that creatures are usually bound inside a reversed Circle of Magic, also fine. But how do you get them there? I see no spells to summon fiends, and the summoning spells they do have are pretty weak. Generally you can get a CR4-6 critter with the Conjure spells, but that isn't really what I'm looking for. I'm guessing they haven't really fleshed it out yet, so I'll probably have to just make it up as I go, but my players are just breaking into 14th level, and the whole Devils and Demons thing is going to play big in the campaign so it's time I start making some rules to cover this stuff. Am I missing anything now in the rules though?

 

[Gadget]

The Unearthed Arcana had an article on this very topic a while ago, you might want to go online and look it up. It sounds like it is right up your alley. Here it is: http://dnd.wizards.com/articles/features/old-black-magic

 

[MonsterEnvy]

So it turns out that I thought planar binding was the spell that summoned the demon, but on reading it turns out that it is an abjuration, for some reason, that binds one into service.

I'd say, recreate the early summon spells. There was an unearthed arcana article that had some demon summoning spells, you may want to look that up as a start and extrapolate from there.

Planar binding can bind demons.


Planar Ally can summon Demons as well. You use it to summon one into a Magic Circle then use Binding to force it into service.

 

[FormerlyHemlock]

I want to know how to proceed on summoning and binding bad guys, elementals, all that. I am the DM, so I can do anything I suppose, but I was also a HUGE fan of spells like Cacodaemon form 1st edition and always loved that aspect of the game. Sadly, as it stands now in 5e I'm not sure how this is supposed to work.

Planar Binding looked promising but has a long cast time and basically is like a longer term no concentrate Dominate spell that take awhile to cast. Ok, fine. But they suggest that creatures are usually bound inside a reversed Circle of Magic, also fine. But how do you get them there? I see no spells to summon fiends, and the summoning spells they do have are pretty weak. Generally you can get a CR4-6 critter with the Conjure spells, but that isn't really what I'm looking for. I'm guessing they haven't really fleshed it out yet, so I'll probably have to just make it up as I go, but my players are just breaking into 14th level, and the whole Devils and Demons thing is going to play big in the campaign so it's time I start making some rules to cover this stuff. Am I missing anything now in the rules though?

You have two options in the PHB: Gate, and True Polymorph. True Polymorph gets you up to CR 9 (Gelugons/Nycaloths/etc.) at little cost whereas Gate can get you Balors/Pit Fiends/etc. but has more prerequisites.

 

[MonsterEnvy]

You have two options in the PHB: Gate, and True Polymorph. True Polymorph gets you up to CR 9 (Gelugons/Nycaloths/etc.) at little cost whereas Gate can get you Balors/Pit Fiends/etc. but has more prerequisites.

You forgot about Planer Ally. Also True Polymorph can't summon demons.

 

[FormerlyHemlock]

You forgot about Planer Ally. Also True Polymorph can't summon demons.

I'm not counting Planar Ally because:

1. Someone else already said it; no need to repeat.
2. I hate clerics.
3. It doesn't actually summon anything, per se, and kidnapping without pay the creatures it does summon may have diplomatic repercussions with the entity doing the sending.

True Polymorph creates fiends/celestial/etc. that you can bind. Functionally identical to summoning except with fewer diplomatic repercussions when all the Couatls go missing, or don't.

 

[MechaTarrasque]

Planar ally is a cleric spell (bard too with magical secrets), but, if the cleric is feeling suicidal, (s)he can ask for a fiend, and the wizard can bind it. I am pretty sure that most cleric's bosses would take a dim view of that (and planar ally might only give you manes and lemures until you get out of the dog house).

The conjure elemental spell would be a good one to use as a basis. Not only does it give you up to a CR 9 critter (if you spend a 9th level spell on it), but if you lose concentration, the summoned critter is out to get you, which seems appropriate for summoning fiends.

Conjure celestial is less good--you max out at CR 5, because celestials have a bunch of utility abilities that fiends and elementals don't have. In 5e, most fiends are pure combat monsters, and spending a 9th level spell for a CR 5 combat monster is inefficient to say the least.

I will second Gadget that the Old Black Magic UA article is the best option.

 

[Guest 6801328]

The Unearthed Arcana had an article on this very topic a while ago, you might want to go online and look it up. It sounds like it is right up your alley. Here it is: http://dnd.wizards.com/articles/features/old-black-magic

I had forgotten about this UA. This hasn't made it into official (AL-legal) sources yet, has it?

 

[MonsterEnvy]

Planar ally is a cleric spell (bard too with magical secrets), but, if the cleric is feeling suicidal, (s)he can ask for a fiend, and the wizard can bind it. I am pretty sure that most cleric's bosses would take a dim view of that (and planar ally might only give you manes and lemures until you get out of the dog house).

if you know the name of a specific outsider you can summon them using planer ally. No need to beseech someone. So if you know Errtu's name you can summon the balor. There is a chance you might not get him, but you can.

I'm not counting Planar Ally because:

1. Someone else already said it; no need to repeat.
2. I hate clerics.
3. It doesn't actually summon anything, per se, and kidnapping without pay the creatures it does summon may have diplomatic repercussions with the entity doing the sending.

True Polymorph creates fiends/celestial/etc. that you can bind. Functionally identical to summoning except with fewer diplomatic repercussions when all the Couatls go missing, or don't.

1 fine.
2 why?
3 Uh yes it does summon things. True Polymoprh does not. Thus making it not an answer to this question. Which is about summoning them.

Also I don't think there would be any repercussions to binding. Particularly if they were summoned via naming that fiend directly.

 

[FormerlyHemlock]

if you know the name of a specific outsider you can summon them using planer ally. No need to beseech someone. So if you know Errtu's name you can summon the balor. There is a chance you might not get him, but you can.

You're still beseeching.

You beseech an otherworldly entity for aid. The
being must be known to you: a god, a primordial, a
demon prince, or some other being of cosmic power.
That entity sends a celestial, an elemental, or a fiend
loyal to it to aid you, making the creature appear in
an unoccupied space within range. If you know a
specific creature’s name, you can speak that name
when you cast this spell to request that creature,
though you might get a different creature anyway
(GM’s choice).

Cleric: "Oh, mighty Pelor, please send me Errtu to my aid!"
Pelor: "Er, no?"

I suppose you could beseech Errto directly:

Cleric: "Oh mighty Errtu, please send Errtu to my aid!"
Errtu: "Here, have a dretch instead."