T&B: Is Energy Substitution (Sonic) unbalanced?

[Numion]

A simple silence spell will negate that Cone of Sound, but most groups won't use silence because it hinders the spellcasters' ability to cast spells.

I probably wouldn't allow it.

 

[bret]

First, the nit-pick: Shout is 4th-level, but Cone of Cold is 5th-level. So one big reason it's better, energy-substitution or no energy-substitution, is because it's a level higher than its competition.

My bad, I was in a hurry and didn't double check the spell levels. Sorry.

It doesn't get rid of the argument though, since you could just use ES on a Lighting Bolt or FireBall and get 1d6/level.


I agree with the posters that say deafness is no protection against Sonic Attacks.

Thanks for pointing out the trolls, I had completely missed that. Time to go read up on them a bit more carefully.

Thanks for all the comments people. I'm finding it useful.

 

[Gez]

Oh, trolls are not the only ones. Take a Frost Worm or a White Dragon (for example), and you'll prefer to have a Fireball ready than a Soundball. (Of course, you'll still prefer the Cone of Sound to the Cone of Cold against such an opponent. But then, a Fire Giant...)

I think the balance is pretty much respected. Each energy has its uses, and none is the absolute best to use. A spellslinger who focuses on only one energy would do better, maybe, by choosing Sound over the other, but focusing on only one energy is not a good strategy: don't put all your eggs in the same basket !

 

[Victim]

Also, I wouldn't compare 4th level spells for damage. A Sonic Fireball can do so much more damage than a Shout spell. However, try comparing Fireball and Lightning bolt to either shout or ice storm. In each case, the 4th level spell is generally inferior for raw damage dealing.

I'd say that Shout is approximately equal to a Sonic Icestorm.

IIRC, Formians have sonic resistance and destrqchans get a bonus to saves against sonic attacks. A bard is also quite effective against a character loaded with sonic spells.

 

[wolff96]

Re: Energy Substitution - Sonic

It's a good choice because there are very few creatures resistant or immune. The only one I can think of is a Destrachan, and that creature only gets a +4 to it's saving throws.

For maximum bang for the buck, though, you have to add in one other substitution: Acid.

Between the two, you have a spell for any situation. Acid for regenerating monsters, sonic damage for anyone else, and the base elemental spells when you face a monster with that weakness.
For the truly foresighted, Mastery of Elements from the Archmage (FRCS) prestige class is the way to go, though. For one 8th level spell slot, you effectively get all of the Energy Substitutions.

Ah, the joys of being a sorcerer and prepared for all occasions.

 

[LightPhoenix]

Btw, there are sounds that cannot be heard. My layman's brain is telling me, in fact, that most sounds that cause severe damage are outside of the range of human hearing. While this may or may not be true, I wouldn't say the Cone of Cacaphony must necessarily alert the entire dungeon to the party's presence...

The reason that certain sound ranges can't be heard is because our ears aren't good enough. Sound is more damaging (to humans) when it's really loud. For dogs, high pitched sounds hurt their ears, which is why they howl when you blow those high-frequency whistles.

You could house rule that anything with exceptional hearing (bonus to Listen checks) takes additional damage from Sonic attacks.

LightPhoenix

 

[Henry]

One thing that I hope will not be forgotten is that all of the Elemental protection spells (Endure Elements, Resist Elements, Protection from Elements) have their energy types set at the time of casting, so these spells can offer protection from ANY energy type easily. Yes, there are less sound resistant creatures than other types, but there are quite a few spells of protection that can stop them or reduce them - Sound is not quite the impossible killer energy type that it appears to be. I dare say that adventurers will be running into more priests than regenerating creatures, anyway.

 

[apsuman]

Good points all.

The only reason to take the feat is to be prepared for the baddies that are immune to your spell(s) of choice.

If you are wandering in the Broken Hills, you might expect to see a Frost Giant, and would prepare your cone of fire, for example. If I remember correctly some (all?) ice based creatures would take extra damage from fire based spells. But there is no extra damage to anyone with a cone of sound.

I guess what I am saying is that since the feat already lets you change the energy type in the first place, you already have the option to switch it FROM the least advantageous type. The hidden cost of ES(sonic) is that you can never change it into MOST advantageous type.

Plus there are drawbacks to the sonic attacks. I would guess EVERYONE would hear your Cone of Sound, silence spell would block it (imho), Trolls (and others) have a lessened effect to sonic attacks.

g!

 

[Ridley's Cohort]

The fact that a common 2nd level spell will negate your sonic attacks is a pretty severe downside. After all, by the time you gain signficant advantage from energy substitution, even the orcs you meet may have access to this spell.

 

[Cabral]

Would using Energy Substitution [Sonic] on a Fireshield spell allow you to be protected against sonic attacks?

PS. Sonic attacks are effectively a blunt force attack (similiar to a punch). A bard that can set up destructive interference against the incoming sound attack could potentially nullify it. (which would also silence it, btw) You could add the house rule that the modifier to the save also increases the DC to notice the attack ...

If you really want to amp bards, allow them to use a ready action to make a perform check against some DC to interupt any one spellcasting attempt of a spell within 30 feet.