Talented feat and overchanneling

[chronichebetude]

Does the Talented feat in psionics apply when you overchannel to increase your manifester level by more than one? The only listed restrictions are that you must expend your psionic focus and the power must be 3rd level or lower to take no damage from overchanneling. So it seems like it would be legal to apply the feat when overchanneling for 2 or 3 extra levels, but when you use it like that it gets a little sticky.

This is the situation that bothered me about the feat: My character's a 12th level psion and can overchannel for up to two extra levels(max of 14 power points on a power.) She has a 6th level Breath of the Black Dragon power, 11 pp, which does 11d6 damage plus an extra 1d6 damage for every extra point spent. She can overchannel to spend 14 pp and do 14d6 damage, but must take 3d8 damage from overchanneling.

She also has a 3rd level Energy Bolt power, 5 pp, which does 5d6 damage plus an extra 1d6 damage for every extra point spent. If she overchannels to spend 14 pp on this power(an extra 9 pp), its damage increases to 14d6, the same as her Breath power, but with the Talented feat she would take no overchanneling damage because the Bolt is only 3rd level. On top of that, Energy Bolt can do an extra +1 point of damage per die if cold or fire energy is used. If fire energy is used, it does another extra point of damage per die because my character has the Privileged Energy feat with fire specified.

So if Talented really does work when you overchannel to increase your manifester level by 2 or 3, the augmented Bolt would not only do more damage than an augmented Breath, it wouldn't require taking damage like the Breath would. This just seemed off to me. Is it really legal? It's out of the Expanded Psionics Handbook, if that helps any.

It's entirely possible that I've just completely messed up somewhere here, so I may just be making a dumb mistake somewhere. =)

 

[Bacris]

Does the Talented feat in psionics apply when you overchannel to increase your manifester level by more than one? The only listed restrictions are that you must expend your psionic focus and the power must be 3rd level or lower to take no damage from overchanneling. So it seems like it would be legal to apply the feat when overchanneling for 2 or 3 extra levels, but when you use it like that it gets a little sticky.

You're reading it correctly.

If the power being manifested is below 3rd level (so powers like crystal shard, energy ray, energy missile, astral construct, mind thrust, etc), you can use Talented, regardless of how many manifester levels you're pumping up.

If the power is above 3rd level (such as Energy Ball, Breath of the Black Dragon, and the like), then you cannot use Talented, but can still use Overchannel.

However, something to keep in mind is that most higher level powers are at least somewhat better than lower level powers, even if not overwhelmingly so. For example, effects that are based on power level (like globe of invulnerability), that higher level power is a safer bet. Breath of the Black Dragon is also acid damage, which is often less resisted.

The benefit is those lower level powers stay worthwhile for longer, although they still have their weak points (spell turning is another example - a 17 pp energy missile is still 3rd level, not 9th).

 

[Arkhandus]

It's only related to the level of the power; you can Overchannel a power of 3rd-level or lower (such as Energy Ray) without taking any damage from the Overchannel, if you use the Talented feat and expend psionic focus for it. It doesn't matter how many effective manifester levels you Overchanneled for; the Talented feat is based on power level, not manifester level.

I think that's what you were asking about? At least the first part.

Breath of the Black Dragon has a more-useful area of effect, though somewhat smaller (how often do you find a bunch of enemies lined up in a thin row so you can hit them all with a Lightning Bolt or similar effect? How much more often do you have to face enemies who are spread out more widely?).

Energy Bolt is just a bit more efficient than it should be, though. Keep in mind though, in order to avoid the Overchannel damage with Energy Bolt, you have to spend a feat on Talented, and also expend your psionic focus each time you use it, both of which carry opportunity costs.



When you Overchannel for Breath of the Black Dragon, you could be applying a metapsionic feat to it or something else, rather than just boosting its damage through augmenting. It still carries the same opportunity cost, but it just might be more effective (though it does result in you taking the Overchannel damage unfortunately). You could be taking a metapsionic feat instead, and expending your psionic focus to apply that to BotBD instead of Talented for Energy Bolt.

(you can't expend your psionic focus for both benefits on an Energy Bolt, so it becomes a choice between: take Talented and use Energy Bolt at full power without taking extra damage myself, or take a metapsionic feat and use Breath of the Black Dragon at a little more power or across an extra-large area of effect, but suffering a bit of damage from Overchannel with the BotBD)


You could, for example, manfiest BotBD augmented only by 1 point to 12d6 damage, and also apply Empower Power to make it 12d6+(12d6x0.5) damage (similar to 18d6 in effect). Or you could do the same but with Enlarge Power instead of Empower Power, doubling the range that your BotBD cone will reach out to and affect (so you'd blast a 110-foot long, and 110-feet wide at its end, cone of acid that deals 12d6 damage).

 

[Christian]

you can't expend your psionic focus for both benefits on an Energy Bolt...

... unless your psicrystal is holding an extra focus for you. Of course, it costs another feat to be able to do that.

 

[Bacris]

Of course, it costs another feat to be able to do that.

Two, actually, since getting a psicrystal costs a feat