I won't comment on the abuse situations, but if someone was trying to teleport out of a restrain or grab, but had no where to go because of tight quarters or for some reason didn't have LoS to any squares other than his own, I might be inclined to allow it. Otherwise, the "new space" clause makes RAW pretty clear for me.
Teleporting Back to the Same Spot
- Thread starter Xyrlove Woodsoul
- Start date
If you want to teleport to the same square you are in and not move I would allow this imo - as the player can. 90% of the time, just teleport 1 square up then fall the 5ft back to the floor - take no damage from falling and thus not go prone.
This has pretty much the same effect as teleporting 0 squares, so why not just let the guy teleport 0?
If you want to teleport an enemy 0 squares to count as leaving and reentering a zone - I call foul, as the equivalent trick against an enemy wouldn't leave any zone that wasn't 1 Square and would allow a saving throw to avoid the vertical teleport and fall (even if no damage comes from the fall).
So imo a Teleport 0 on a willing target should be ok - on an enemy it should only be considered to have happened if the "movement" has no effect on the game state of the enemy in question. As such I might allow a teleport 0 effect on an enemy that triggered a "If you teleport an enemy using one of your powers that enemy is dazed until the end of your next turn" effect - as I would feel the unexpectted exposure to the Feywild causes the dazed not the motion but no Leave/Enter effects related to the square would trigger.
And as an aside into pure RAW not RAI (Not sure what side of this arguement I take tbh):
I suddenly find myslef wondering if Pushing someone 0 squares can still be considered Pushing them? If you have an effect that says, for eg, "If you push an enemy, that enemy is knocked prone", and you use a power that pushes 3 squares but you choose to push 0 - would the enemy still be prone?
You can use a move action to Walk 0 and still have been assumed to have used a move action (so can now Stealth say) so can you Push 0 and still have pushed? Would the arguement change on a Shift 0, as a Push must get further away but a Shift can be any direction, so can it be No Direction? Suddenly thinking about Shifts/Push/Pull as vectors that can have a direction even if they have 0 magnetude - So a Push 0 does still move them away from you - just a total of 0 squares away.
Please no flames - I am purely asking from a theoretical view point on RAW - not any desire to abuse this (I would probably DM it as "Does that sound cool but not too cheesy? Alright then." and play it as "I'll just assume this doesn't work.").
This has pretty much the same effect as teleporting 0 squares, so why not just let the guy teleport 0?
If you want to teleport an enemy 0 squares to count as leaving and reentering a zone - I call foul, as the equivalent trick against an enemy wouldn't leave any zone that wasn't 1 Square and would allow a saving throw to avoid the vertical teleport and fall (even if no damage comes from the fall).
So imo a Teleport 0 on a willing target should be ok - on an enemy it should only be considered to have happened if the "movement" has no effect on the game state of the enemy in question. As such I might allow a teleport 0 effect on an enemy that triggered a "If you teleport an enemy using one of your powers that enemy is dazed until the end of your next turn" effect - as I would feel the unexpectted exposure to the Feywild causes the dazed not the motion but no Leave/Enter effects related to the square would trigger.
And as an aside into pure RAW not RAI (Not sure what side of this arguement I take tbh):
I suddenly find myslef wondering if Pushing someone 0 squares can still be considered Pushing them? If you have an effect that says, for eg, "If you push an enemy, that enemy is knocked prone", and you use a power that pushes 3 squares but you choose to push 0 - would the enemy still be prone?
You can use a move action to Walk 0 and still have been assumed to have used a move action (so can now Stealth say) so can you Push 0 and still have pushed? Would the arguement change on a Shift 0, as a Push must get further away but a Shift can be any direction, so can it be No Direction? Suddenly thinking about Shifts/Push/Pull as vectors that can have a direction even if they have 0 magnetude - So a Push 0 does still move them away from you - just a total of 0 squares away.
Please no flames - I am purely asking from a theoretical view point on RAW - not any desire to abuse this (I would probably DM it as "Does that sound cool but not too cheesy? Alright then." and play it as "I'll just assume this doesn't work.").
Infiniti2000
First Post
I think that if you don't actually push/slide/pull the target, i.e. 0 squares, then the action is not counted as for pushing/sliding/pulling.
You teleport to an extra-dimensional space still within the zone kind of like dropping a bag of holding over your head and then coming back out. Except the teleport is instantaneous.
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Obryn
Hero
I think this should pretty much always be handled as a DM judgment call. For example, if an Eladrin wanted to teleport out of a monster's grasp but stay in the same square, I'd allow it. If a player wanted to teleport an enemy, currently inside a wall of fire, back into the same space and thus suffer the effects again, I wouldn't.
-O
-O
Ryujin
Legend
The phrasing of teleporting out of an immobilizing effect ("...you can teleport away...") implies to me that you can't stay where you are, so I wouldn't allow it. Actually I wouldn't allow a same-square teleport at all, and my character is a Feylock with an at-will teleport 5.
Obryn
Hero
OK? I would. As I said, I think it's a judgment call, and there's not a wrong way to do it. IMO, because PCs are not actually 5' cubes moving around a 5' interval grid, it should work just fine; it's just a quick hop outside a monster's grasp. I like the grid to represent what's going on in the game world, not dictate it.
-O
Ryujin
Legend
Perhaps they aren't 5' cubes, but treating them like that speeds play, which improves the overall experience. Simplicity of mechanic, in my opinion, makes play more enjoyable for all. Sure, you can step outside the box from time to time, but some things smack of playing the system, rather than the game.
Obryn
Hero
OK? YMM certainly V. Like I said, it's a judgment call, and judgment calls vary from game to game. For my own game, I think it would detract from the play experience to require them to teleport 1 square for arbitrary grid-related reasons, when teleporting just a foot or so outside a tentacle's grasp is cinematically cool and we can all picture it in our heads. It's not gaming the system - it's making a ruling that makes sense to me.
For other tables, there are other priorities, to be sure.
-O
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