D&D 5E Templates and 5th edition

[NotAYakk]

An example (I have not tested this yet - it is just a concept):

Monster Templates: Brute
A brute is a destructive tank. The typically wade into melee to do the most damage possible. It can take and inflict more damage than its typical kin, but it sacrifices its accuracy and ability to avoid damage. You can make the following adjustments to a monster to make it a bruiser without changing its CR:

• add its prof. bonus to its weapon damage on a hit
• subtract half its prof. bonus from its to hit bonus on a weapon attack
• Increase its hit points by 5 for each point of its prof. bonus
• subtract 1 from its AC for every 2 points of its prof. bonus

CR change:
+Prof/12*# attacks
-Prof/4 from accuracy
+Prof * 5/64 from HP
-Prof/8 from AC

Total:
(# attacks/12 - .3)*Prof

 

[dave2008]

CR change:
+Prof/12*# attacks
-Prof/4 from accuracy
+Prof * 5/64 from HP
-Prof/8 from AC

Total:
(# attacks/12 - .3)*Prof

yay - I'm never going to put that in a template

Also, I am not interested in increasing the number of attacks, for a brute particularly

 

[NotAYakk]

yay - I'm never going to put that in a template

Also, I am not interested in increasing the number of attacks, for a brute particularly

Oh I am just modelling what it does to the CR of the monster.

When #attacks/12 is 0.3 it is neutral, or at 4 attacks.

Below 4 attacks your brute is marginally weaker by the DMG CR rules, above marginally stronger.

At 1 attack, at Prof 5, your brute is about a CR weaker? Which isn't a huge issue.

You can fix it by, hmm, giving it [prof]d8 bonus damage, spread out over attacks. Instead of adding prof to attack damage.

.. wait, I subtracted full prof from accuracy in my math.
1/4+5/64 = k/12 gives k of 2.5.
make that 1d4 per prof spread out over attacks.

 

[dave2008]

Oh I am just modelling what it does to the CR of the monster.

When #attacks/12 is 0.3 it is neutral, or at 4 attacks.

Below 4 attacks your brute is marginally weaker by the DMG CR rules, above marginally stronger.

At 1 attack, at Prof 5, your brute is about a CR weaker? Which isn't a huge issue.

You can fix it by, hmm, giving it [prof]d8 bonus damage, spread out over attacks. Instead of adding prof to attack damage.

.. wait, I subtracted full prof from accuracy in my math.
1/4+5/64 = k/12 gives k of 2.5.
make that 1d4 per prof spread out over attacks.

Like I said, I wasn't doing the math, just discussing the concept. Thank you for the analysis though, it gave me an idea of how to fix things

 

[NotAYakk]

Like I said, I wasn't doing the math, just discussing the concept. Thank you for the analysis though, it gave me an idea of how to fix things

So I'm stealing from the DMG monster CR rules.

64 HP, 12 damage per round at-will (before missing) (or +36 over at-will once per encounter), 4 ATK or AC-equivalent all map to about 1 CR change (in the range 1 to 20 CR) using the DMG CR rules.

(64 not 60, because increased HP also implies increased AC, so I put a small tax on it; for damage, the tax is too small to see).

So a "zero CR" brute change is:
+8 HP (0.25), +1d6 damage (per round) (0.25), -1 ATK (-0.25), -1 AC (-0.25).
scale as needed to make it brutey enough.

Another approach is to not have the penalties.

"Pump it UP":
+72 HP (1.12), +3d6 damage (0.88)
worth +2 CR

 

[Vaalingrade]

So when you add something new to an old monster, you rewrite the monster's stat block?

Yep. Simple, right? It's all about simple! ~He says with a single tear streaming down his eye, remembering they heyday of cool and easy monster modifications~

 

[Li Shenron]

Is there a preferred model?

I loved creatures templates in 3ed!

Back to that edition, both monsters and templates were pretty complex, so it was often a pain to combine them, they were more suitable for use in a digital tool that would do all calculations automatically.

But 5ed is already much simpler with monsters stats, so it could also have equally simple templates. My preferred model would be, no number increases but only additional abilities, which can be anything (attacks, spells, resistances, proficiencies...) but don't have to be a lot of them in a template.

 

[Weiley31]

There are a few templates in 5E, such as the Shadow Dragon and the Dracolich, and those are pretty simple: it just tales ya what to changed, adjust, or damage type of an attack being swapped out for another damage type. Some other 3PP, like the Blue Rose Adventurer's Guide, also has their own templates to apply to monster stat blocks as well.

So 5E, as a whole, has done/experimented with Templates. Thankfully, unlike 3.0/3.5, none of them make your Blue Dragon more of a mutt than my Cocker Spaniel Labrador was. (god rest his little soul, haven't had a dog since he passed.)