Temple of the Frog

[Treebore]

You're never quite "wrong" in Greyhawk, which is one of its beautiful elements.

The original Blackmoor is a different place.

But in my Greyhawk, the Temple of the Frog exists, the Comeback Inn exists (about the only bit of civlization left in ruins of Blackmoor City), and the City of the Gods is out there, somewhere, and unexplained.

You can go a "sci fi intrusion" version or a "fantasy tech with clockworks" version about equally well. I'm sure there are more ways to do it too.

Dungeon magazine, under Paizo's tenure, had several good adventures in the area.

When I decided to use Blackmoor in the Greyhawk area labeled Blackmoor I used all the maps from the Blackmoor supplements. So it was the "real" Blackmoor the way I ran it. They were just very exclusionary and a lot of people didn't like going into Blackmoor any more than they liked going into the lands of Iuz or the Kingdoms of the East, etc... It worked perfectly. Even when players noticed certain maps didn't match up with the over all shapes of the GH map I just said, "Hmmmm, I wonder why that would be?"

Then I would get the lame unimaginative response of, "TSR did the maps wrong."

Then I would say, "Or, more likely, someone in Blackmoor doesn't want accurate maps outside of Blackmoor."

Which actually came up in play when I ran City of the Gods.

 

[Plane Sailing]

I think sci-fi/fantasy crossover was perhaps a lot more common in the 70's generally.

Perhaps a nod to Atlantis-style fantasies of older, more advanced civilisations?

I remember that my first D&D campaign had a desert to the north which had the buried remains of high tech civilisation which offended the gods.

Empire of the Petal Throne is perhaps the grandest possible example of fantasy living upon a sci-fi backstory which works well.

My preference is for the EPT level of technological integration rather than, say, the Gamma World equivalent. The latter I find jarring, the former I find inspiring.

Cheers

 

[Asmor]

Purely out of curiousity -

Has anyone produced guns or sci-fi weaponry stats for 4E?

I did, including 3 new weapon abilities (clip, spread, and unreliable)

Encounter-a-Day » Archive » Treasures & Trinkets: Firearms

 

[Chainsaw]

I think sci-fi/fantasy crossover was perhaps a lot more common in the 70's generally.

Perhaps a nod to Atlantis-style fantasies of older, more advanced civilisations?

May be the case. I love 70s fantasy and it seems that sci-fi pops up more often back then. Again, though, my experience is that it's usually inserted as ancient alien tech and the devices are not usually referred to/described using Star Wars/Star Trek type terminology. That works fine for me because in that context, it adds to the mystery and uncertainty of the mood - it's not disruptive. Nobody in my group would mind stumbling on a strange, moss covered smooth metal thing, shaped like an egg.. but I think people would have a problem if I said, "So, you find an interplanetary space cruiser, but the hyperdrive is clearly broken." Pictures of mixed-settings (like the one at the beginnig of this thread) don't really convey how the material's presented, which may explain why some folks have such knee-jerk negative reactions.

 

[Dire Bare]

One of my favorite pictures too!

I've always felt that the crazy number of different D&D monsters and races fits a sci fantasy campaign better than a straight fantasy campaign!

 

[Jack99]

Purely out of curiousity -

Has anyone produced guns or sci-fi weaponry stats for 4E?

Scarrport has guns, unless my mind is playing tricks on me again.

 

[Cerebral Paladin]

When I decided to use Blackmoor in the Greyhawk area labeled Blackmoor I used all the maps from the Blackmoor supplements. So it was the "real" Blackmoor the way I ran it. They were just very exclusionary and a lot of people didn't like going into Blackmoor any more than they liked going into the lands of Iuz or the Kingdoms of the East, etc... It worked perfectly.

I always assumed that the "Blackmoor" in Greyhawk was intended to be the same as the published Blackmoor. My assumption was always that this was a combination of EGG having initially put in the connection with Greyhawk and then them later putting Blackmoor in the OD&D family (presumably because of the various squabbles between Arneson and TSR back in the day). I also assumed that the old settings had more of a "sure, things can be located in multiple possible worlds-- do whatever's good for your campaign." So if you were running Greyhawk and wanted Blackmoor in Greyhawk, go ahead and run Temple of the Frog. But if you were running Mystara, and wanted Blackmoor to be part of the prehistory, that's cool, too. And if you wanted Greyhawk to be the subsequent history of your Gamma World campaign, rock on.

(I view the duplication of the Blackmoor in multiple campaigns as akin to the use of gods like Moradin in many different campaigns. Sure, that could also be explained by the whole "multiple primes in the same multiverse" model, but outside of the in-game explanation, I think the whole "grab whatever you like" sort of model explains a lot of traditional design. Kinda like how there are Keeps on the Borderlands in any number of different campaign worlds, as different DMs just slotted it in to their campaigns.)

 

[Doug McCrae]

As was the case in fiction such as Jack Vance's Dying Earth, technology pops up all over the place, though the misunderstanding populace mistakes it for magic.

Give an example.

I'm not saying you're wrong, but I'm wondering how you can be sure it's technology and not magic.

In fact, I think that's what's wrong with EttBP. It's not subtle enough about the technology. It should leave it open as to whether it's tech or magic. Not use terms like 'access card' and 'laser rifle'. They should be talismans and blasting rods.

 

[Doug McCrae]

Nobody's going to be calling it a Blaster 9000x though.

It's all about the language. The references to Star Wars are very apt. It's fantasy (and, ofc, sci-fi). Science fiction tells us about the present, by extrapolation. Star Wars is different, it's timeless, an eternal Campbellian story.

Lucas's use of language supports this well. Blaster, not laser. 'Laser' is too precise a term, too scientific. It tells us too much about how the gadget works. 'Midichlorians' are a noteworthy exception, Lucas gets it wrong here. It's far too contemporary and technical a word.

I love the references to the 30s serials in the prequels. The 'ray field' in Episode III is thoroughly Buster Crabbe era Flash Gordon.

 

[Lord Zack]

I'm currently working on a campaign that includes a lot of Sci-Fi elements. This is in part because it's based on Final Fantasy I, but takes the Sci-Fi to much higher extremes. For instance my equivalents to the four crystals are in fact high tech facilities meant to regulate the natural forces of the world, one for each of the four elements. My equivalent of the Sky Castle is in fact a space station in low orbit. And yes there will be a War Mech expy, and in fact many robotic enemies. There's more about it in my blog, in the post "The Legacy of the Titans".