Temporary Hit Points

[KarinsDad]

but it's clear enough, that the intent of the rules in general is, that no two spells of the same effect (or even the very same spell twice) should have any added benefit.

I do not disagree.

I do see, however, that having a targeted duration spell up twice minimally protects you from losing it quickly via Dispel Magic. Two Blur spells, although they do not stack, one get Dispelled, the other is still protecting you.

This works for all other such spells, but according to a "nope, no benefits at all" philosophy, does not work for "temporary points" type of spells such as multiple Protection From Energy, multiple temporary hit points, etc.


So, we seem to have a contradiction here in the intent of the rules. The intent of multiple similar spells is that they do not stack, but you do not lose either spell either. The overlap type of solution goes against that "intent of the rules" for some form of perceived imbalance sake.

Not that adjusting how spells work for balance is not important, but it is a difference between RAW and DM preference.

 

[Thanee]

I see what you mean, but isn't that quite some difference, whether one spell is ended forcefully or one with an ablative effect is "used up" as intended and then the other takes over and continues the work?

To me, this totally contradicts the idea of "non stacking".

There really would be very little difference to just adding them up then.

Bye
Thanee

 

[KarinsDad]

I see what you mean, but isn't that quite some difference, whether one spell is ended forcefully or one with an ablative effect is "used up" as intended and then the other takes over and continues the work?

To me, this totally contradicts the idea of "non stacking".

There really would be very little difference to just adding them up then.

True.

I think WotC should make ablative spells a targeting issue.

If you already have temporary hit points, then you are an invalid target and a new temporary hit point spell (even if it has other differing effects) will not target you.

That would avoid all of the problems (tmk).

 

[Thanee]

Hmm... I actually think it's better if the total simply gets replaced (kinda like the "memory" stuff I had written earlier), but only if the new total is higher (unless, of course, an effect specifically says otherwise). And that's how I play it as well. Always did.

It seems to cover all relevant stacking effects (especially having the higher effect take precedance), does work towards the spirit of the stacking issues with ablative effects (as explained above) and I also don't think it contradicts any rules (it does fill in some blanks, of course).

Bye
Thanee

 

[KarinsDad]

Hmm... I actually think it's better if the total simply gets replaced (kinda like the "memory" stuff I had written earlier), but only if the new total is higher (unless, of course, an effect specifically says otherwise). And that's how I play it as well. Always did.

But, what about duration issues?

Example:

Get Aid for 4 points on round one.
Manifest Vigor for 10 points on round two.
Took 2 points of damage.
5 rounds later, Vigor expires

So, what are you left with?

1) 0 Aid temporary hit points cause Vigor replaced Aid (even though you only took 2 points of damage and Aid would have still had 2 left if Vigor was not manifested).

2) 2 Aid temporary hit points cause you subtracted the 2 from both the 10 and the 4.

3) 4 Aid temporary hit points caues you subtracted the 2 from the 10, but got nowhere near the 4.

And, of course, the example could get more complex, especially with more spells in the mix.

Whatever you use, you'll have to have it well defined and I'm not sure you did that quite yet unless you meant #1 by "replaced", but that is a bit of a rip off to the PC/NPC. Some other short duration spell made my long duration slightly less powerful spell useless.

 

[Thanee]

But, what about duration issues?

Example:

Get Aid for 4 points on round one.
Manifest Vigor for 10 points on round two.
Took 2 points of damage.
5 rounds later, Vigor expires

So, what are you left with?

Would be 0 then.

But you are right with the "rip off" part, it's more reasonable, if 2 are left then, so not exactly what I have written above (which would result in 0), but rather in a way, that damage gets subtracted from every individual amount of temporary hps. Tho, you still only really have one total, the others just stay in the background (are overlapped).

Bye
Thanee