D&D General The abandoned core monsters of D&D

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

So these new monsters might basically be ascended homebrew? Interesting idea. (I suppose that also suggests a reason some didn't stick around - their creators weren't around to advocate for them anymore.)

I look at the 3E list and I find myself missing very few of them. The ethereal marauder I like, because you can reskin it as a Zork grue and have it move in and out of the Plane of Shadow/Shadowfell.

But stuff like the digester are there for Gygaxian Naturalism ("look, it all hangs together in a logical ecosystem, I promise") but don't really inspire most DMs to say "ooh, I gotta put this in my next adventure," which I'd argue is the ultimate goal of monsters in an RPG bestiary. The digester feels very much like something from someone's home campaign that everyone else was too tired to argue about when assembling the list of final monsters for the book. ("If we let him have his digester, maybe he will agree to let us push the xvart into a later book instead.")

 

[JEB]

I look at the 3E list and I find myself missing very few of them. The ethereal marauder I like, because you can reskin it as a Zork grue and have it move in and out of the Plane of Shadow/Shadowfell.

But stuff like the digester are there for Gygaxian Naturalism ("look, it all hangs together in a logical ecosystem, I promise") but don't really inspire most DMs to say "ooh, I gotta put this in my next adventure," which I'd argue is the ultimate goal of monsters in an RPG bestiary. The digester feels very much like something from someone's home campaign that everyone else was too tired to argue about when assembling the list of final monsters for the book. ("If we let him have his digester, maybe he will agree to let us push the xvart into a later book instead.")

It seems the Pathfinder designers may have felt similarly: I noticed the delver and tojanida got lumped in with much older and much better-known Fiend Folio and MM II monsters in their Misfit Monsters Redeemed. And that was only a few years after 3e had ended. Guess they thought they were of a kind...

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

Man, Misfit Monsters Redeemed is such a good book. I sold my hard copy years ago, but I may need to pick it up in PDF.

 

[Orius]

I'm sure the digester's art didn't do it any favors either.

 

[Voadam]

I think a monster that fits in on a Pink Floyd poster is just fine.

 

[JEB]

Last stop: 4e.

Monster Manual
Another long list here!

• Balhannoth
• Banshrae
• Battlebriar
• Berbalang
• Boneclaw
• Eidolon
• Foulspawn
• Godforged colossus
• Kruthik
• Lamia (4e flavor)
• Larva mage
• Quickling
• Rot harbinger
• Shadar-kai
• Shadowraven swarm
• Skull lord
• Sorrowsworn (4e flavor)
• Swordwing
• Warforged
• Abominations: astral stalker, atropal, blood fiend, and phane.
• Behemoths (totally not dinosaurs): bloodspike and macetail.
• Cult of Orcus: crimson acolyte, deathpriest of Orcus, deathpriest hierophant, Doresain.
• Dark ones (darklings): dark creeper, dark stalker
• Demons: evistro (carnage demon) and immolith.
• Devourers: soulspike and viscera.
• Dracoliches: blackfire and runescribed.
• Dragonspawn: blackspawn gloomweb, bluespawn godslayer, and redspawn firebelcher.
• Drakes: needlefang drake swarm, and spiretop.
• Elementals: earthwind ravager, firelasher, rockfire dreadnought, and thunderblast cyclone.
• Ghosts: phantom warrior and trap haunt.
• Giants: death giant, death titan, and storm titan.
• Gibbering beasts: abomination and orb.
• Hags: death and howling.
• Homunculi: iron cobra and iron defender.
• Hydras: fen, mordant, and primordial.
• Magma beasts: brute, claw, hurler, and strider.
• Shifters: longtooth and razorclaw.
• Trolls: fell and war.
• Wights: battle, deathlock, and slaughter.
• Yuan-ti: anathema and snaketongue cultist.
• Zombies: chillborn, corruption corpse, gravehound, hulk, rotter, and rotwing.
• Aboleth servitor
• Battle guardian
• Beholder eye of flame
• Black slaad
• Bloodfire harpy
• Boneshard skeleton
• Cacklefiend hyena
• Chuul juggernaut
• Dusk unicorn
• Elder purple worm
• Fell wyvern
• Feygrove choker
• Firebred hell hound
• Giant mummy
• Great flameskull
• Greater helmed horror
• Guulvorg (worg)
• Hippogriff dreadmount
• Horde ghoul
• Lich vestige
• Marut blademaster
• Oni night haunt
• Primordial naga
• Rimefire griffon
• Shadow hulk (umber hulk)
• Stirge swarm
• Storm gorgon
• Stormrage shambler (shambling mound)
• Sword wraith
• Thunderfury boar
• Thunderhawk (roc)
• Vine horror spellfiend
• Voidsoul specter
• War devil
• Wild hunt hound
• Bats: fire and shadowhunter.
• Beetles: rot scarab swarm and tangler.
• Crocodiles: feymire and visejaw.
• Panthers: fey and spectral.
• Scorpions: hellstinger and stormclaw.
• Snakes: flame and shadow.
• Spiders: bloodweb spider swarm, and demonweb terror.

There are a lot of variants of the core monsters here, as pointed out by @Voadam - probably more than in any other edition. I'm not sure about any other particular pattern to these additions, but I'm open to suggestions!

Monster Vault
Despite being a slimmer and more "iconic" listing than the original 4e MM, there are still a good number of one-offs:

• Archons (4e): earth and water.
• Basilisks: abyssal, mesmeric-eye, and wilt-eye.
• Dracoliches: deathbringer and doomlord.
• Drakes: ambush and bloodseeker.
• Liches: necromancer, remnant, and soulreaver.
• Mummies: moldering, royal, and tomb guardian.
• Ropers: cave, crag, and impaling.
• Rust monsters: gluttonous, and young rust monster swarm.
• Stirges: death husk, suckerling, and suckerling swarm.
• Treants: bramblewood and grove guardian.
• Trolls: battle troll, bladerager troll, and ghost troll render.
• Umber hulks: bewilderer, deep hulk, and tunneler.
• Wraiths: figment and sovereign.
• Zombies: flesh-crazed, grasping, and hulking.
• Abyssal eviscerator (demon)
• Charnel otyugh
• Frost titan (giant)
• Human transmuter
• Poisonscale lizardfolk
• Ravenous ghoul
• Rocktempest gargoyle
• Savage displacer beast
• Skeletal legionary
• Vampire night witch
• Venom-maw hydra
• War hyena
• Wind-claw owlbear
• Bear and horse (generic versions that don't neatly correspond to any other edition's take)
• Spiders: cave and doomspinner.

The main difference seems to be that while the 4e MM has some lesser-known and unique monsters, the MV is strictly about variants of classic monsters. Not sure if there's any particular intent to the variants chosen here vs. the ones in the MM.

4e overall
These were in both the Monster Manual and the Monster Vault, but not core in other editions:

• Dragonborn
• Eladrin (elf flavor)
• Angels: of battle, protection, valor, and vengeance.
• Archons (4e): fire and ice.
• Drakes: guard, rage, and spitting.
• Giants: earth titan and fire titan.
• Skeletons: blazing, decrepit, and skeletal tomb guardian.
• Abyssal ghoul
• Blackroot treant
• Blackscale lizardfolk
• Bog hag
• Deathjump spider
• Dire bulette
• Dire stirge
• Enormous carrion crawler
• Legion devil (merregon)
• Mad wraith
• Medusa (male a la 4e)
• Nabassu gargoyle
• Venom-eye basilisk
• Winterclaw owlbear

This block deserves some extra attention, because while the tones of the two core monsters books are different - major overhaul vs. decidedly retro - these 30 or so remained in both. That suggests the designers were very attached to having them in the game, and so probably say something about the 4e design philosophy. Not sure what, though!

Why didn't any of these carry forward? The pithy, cynical answer is because 5e was trying to win back lapsed fans, and that meant throwing 4e innovations under the bus. I don't know that it's so simple, though, because some new-to-core 4e creatures did carry forward to the 5e MM, like flameskulls and helmed horrors. Ditto a few minor variants that I didn't call out, like the orc eye of Gruumsh (MM) or the gnoll fang of Yeenoghu (MV). But I suppose it wasn't that many, in the grand scheme...

So what do you all think of these 4e refugees? Any you want to see return? (The immolith is one I think is pretty neat. And I'm glad the skull lord returned in MTOF...)

 

[Echohawk]

Why didn't any of these carry forward? The pithy, cynical answer is because 5e was trying to win back lapsed fans, and that meant throwing 4e innovations under the bus. I don't know that it's so simple, though, because some new-to-core 4e creatures did carry forward to the 5e MM, like flameskulls and helmed horrors.

Those two examples, specifically, were new-to-core in 4e, but not new to 4e, so those inclusions still meet the "win back lapsed fans" goal for 5e.

 

[JEB]

Those two examples, specifically, were new-to-core in 4e, but not new to 4e, so those inclusions still meet the "win back lapsed fans" goal for 5e.

True, but I'm still not sure that strategy was them specifically excluding 4e monsters from the core, rather than just focusing on including more long-running monsters. And neither flameskulls nor helmed horrors had been core material before 4e, plus the 4e MM is the only other time they were core (they both weren't in the Monster Vault).

(Also, to be fair, the list of truly brand-new monsters in the 4e MM - beyond variations on older monsters - is very slim. Basically swordwings, and maybe foulspawn, if you ignore their resemblance to MM V's ushemoi.)

 

[pawsplay]

True, but I'm still not sure that strategy was them specifically excluding 4e monsters from the core, rather than just focusing on including more long-running monsters. And neither flameskulls nor helmed horrors had been core material before 4e, plus the 4e MM is the only other time they were core (they both weren't in the Monster Vault).

(Also, to be fair, the list of truly brand-new monsters in the 4e MM - beyond variations on older monsters - is very slim. Basically swordwings, and maybe foulspawn, if you ignore their resemblance to MM V's ushemoi.)

The 4e version of archons were definitely unique to it.

 

[JEB]

The 4e version of archons were definitely unique to it.

They certainly count as distinct from the earlier versions of the archon! But it is true that monsters called "archons" weren't new to D&D (it was in fact the third time the name was used - besides the AD&D line there was also a Basic "archon", all of which were planar monsters).

Same goes for "angels" and "lamia" and "sorrowsworn" - absolutely distinctive in their 4e incarnation, but still not completely novel in the way swordwings were. (Though I think the 4e lamia is prime for a return as a renamed monster in 5e, rather like a version of the 4e archons snuck in as the "elemental myrmidons".)