The Aleasana Meta-Thread!

[Rhialto]

The thing is Kalizar, Karrina and Volg really haven't been set forth as "factions"--they're cities, which might be trying for the throne, but seem to be supporting others or staying neutral.

Mind you, if you want to detail their leadership, and figure out where they stand in the struggle, I'm all for it.

 

[Rhialto]

Just to keep this thread on the charts...

I think having some sort of factional loyalty/involvement rules (ala Star Wars) might fit the feel. Any thoughts on this?

 

[Lalato]

Just wanted to note that I think the Odraani Imperium should be evil, but that like the rest of Aleasana suffers under constant bickering between various factions. It makes a bit more sense than a pro-undead liberation empire... which on its face is a bit farcical.

--sam

 

[Rhialto]

I have mixed feelings on this. On the one hand, the Imperium as a generally LN nation of undead who seek to forward their own agenda is more interesting then your standard "Land of the Dead". On the other hand--it is a little silly, as written...

 

[Lalato]

I have mixed feelings on this. On the one hand, the Imperium as a generally LN nation of undead who seek to forward their own agenda is more interesting then your standard "Land of the Dead". On the other hand--it is a little silly, as written...

Lawful Neutral is fine, but the Undead Liberation seems a bit over the top... Just because a government's policies are Lawful Neutral doesn't mean that those that hold the keys of power are themselves Lawful or Neutral. The Lich Emperor could very well be some form of Evil... and his plans for Aleasana may also be evil.

Perhaps the Lawful Neutral nature of policy is a way to keep the other intelligent undead in line instead of constantly bickering amongst themselves... anyway... just a thought.

--sam

 

[Conaill]

I don't mind rewriting it, but here are the elements I would like to keep in:

- Undead - and especially intelligent undead - in Aleasana should not be considered Evil by default. (This also opens up some very interesting options for PCs!)

- Undead have the same rights as the living in Odraani. The undead walk the streets, and nobody bats an eye. A cleric destroying a bunch of undead will be held to the same standards as someone mowing down a bunch of living citizens.

The undead liberation theme is a logical consequence, and mainly serves to add some moral ambiguity. I just love shades of grey, I guess.

Oh, and the liberation missions are there to provide adventuring hooks. Pretty much any dungeon the PC's are exploring, the DM could work in an encounter with an Odraani rescue team. Maybe they're just neutral bystanders as long as the PCs don't harm the undead in the dungeon. Or perhaps they're raiding the local graveyard and the PCs are called in to put a stop to it. Or the Odraani team is trying to "liberate" an ancient evil buried in a tomb for ages.

 

[Conaill]

For what it's worth, Ghosts are at least one type of core undead which can take on any alignment. They may very well be the only core ones - I didn't check them all. [Edit: mummies are "Usually lawful evil", so are not obligated to be Evil either.]

I'd prefer just to make this a rules change for Aleasana in general. We can even keep it very limited such as "any undead may have an alignment which is one step closer to Lawful Good than listed". (Yeah, I know, this should really go in the rules thread, but nobody reads that one )

 

[Sarellion]

I just wanted to ask if we really want a 400 year long civil war? Then the situation today isn´t special. I personally think that no idea of a nation would survive through 400 years of warfare or at least constant bickering. Nobody would pay any heed who is sitting on the throne in a remote castle of a long dead kingdom.

My 2 cents on the Imperium:
Doesn´t ring a bell with me. The Imperium would probably be a major powerhouse with the guys practising necromancy and all the undead who don´t need provisions, can march without tiring and press on on exhausted soldiers. There is probably no nation that could take them unless they unite and the uniting theme against the evil undead is very old...
And the undead liberation army seems to be a little bit silly.

Just my opinion and I know it is too late now.

 

[Conaill]

Would this be a more acceptable write-up for the Odraani Imperium:

Despite it's reputation, the Odraani Imperium contains a surprising number of Neutral and even Good-aligned undead, and overall could perhaps best be described as Lawful Neutral. Undead are granted the same rights as the living, and wander the streets with impunity.

Although the Fey typically stay out of mortal affairs in Aleasana, they consider undead an abomination, and there have been frequent but unorganized conflicts along the Odraani border.

 

[Arkhandus]

There's nothing wrong or illogical about having the Imperium consisting largely of undead, Sarellion. I made it clear in my original post on them that it was a small nation on Aleasana's border. A small number of necromancers and evil clerics can only do so much animating, and can only control so many undead at a time. Inevitably, if they don't keep a close reign on the more chaotic undead, they WILL be overthrown by anarchs, hungry ghouls who just have a sudden urge to eat the nearest living thing, enterprising wights and such who think they should rule instead, or wraiths who just want everything fleshy to die. Or rival vampires, liches, or mummies who want to take the place of the living rulers. So they are definitely going to have limits on how many undead they create, based on how many they can control or keep track of at any given time.

And after all, they need corpses to animate, and those'll be hard to come by if their opponents have anything to say about it (i.e. burning the dead on the battlefield, for instance). Most undead are not intelligent anyway, and are not very powerful, so they're usually easy to destroy if an army of them starts marching. They may be tougher than living warriors, but will have more limited tactics and strategies, slower movement (generally), and ultimately be much more dependent on their leaders surviving. Note that spells like Create Undead and Create Greater Undead are fairly high-level, so very very few casters will be capable of creating anything more than mindless zombies and skeletons. And most of the casters won't be very high-level, so won't be able to create nor control more than few undead. Then they have to go risking themselves if they intend to direct their undead forces against a military target.....


I have no problem with Odraani having some good or neutral undead, but it is likely to be overall evil or at least run by evil undead. If they actually go out seeking to "liberate" corpses and spirits from elsewhere, then it's almost certainly just because they want whatever knowledge or power those dead may have, or want to bolster the ranks of their undead army through corpse-stealing. Regardless of whether or not the undead are treated well once inside the Imperium, their overall purpose is likely to be vengeance upon Aleasana or something.