The Books of Amber 6-10, care to share your opinion?

The second example above was Changeling, with its sequel Madwand.

Again, I agree that the first Amber series was better than the second- when isn't the original better than the sequel??- but I maintain that the Merlin series has a lot of cool stuff in it, i.e. the discussion of magic, a lot more stuff on the nature of shadow, Chaos, etc...
 

log in or register to remove this ad

It has been a long time since I read the Amber series but I definately remember that books 6-10 took a lot longer to get through than the first 5. I did like the character Merlin (although he is imposssibly dense in parts of the book) but the action and plotting seemed very haphazard and just not at the level of the first series.

I would say skip them - you really aren't missing all that much of the Amber universe and Zelaney has better stories you can read (Changeling especially!)
 

The Merlin series was good the first 2 or 3 books and then things got weird. It got too deep I think and kinda pieced together. I'd love to get my hands on all Zelazny's Amber short stories and read them each at the moment they were occuring in the series. DOn't know if that would help any, but it couldn't hurt.
 

I say read the last 5 as well. While they're not as good as the first five in many ways, in others they absolutely rock. I really, really enjoyed learning a lot more of the ultimate "truth" of the universe: you learn just how subjective Corwin was, which is awesome, and as a result it allows you to question just how truthful Merlin is. If you didn't see it that way, try reading them again with that thought in mind. They're much better.

Mr. Zelazny told me that "straight through with no editing, letting the story go where it wants to" is, in fact, how he wrote all of his non-collaborative books. He told me this while he was writing A Night in the Lonesome October, so he may have changed after that, but all of his major works were written that way. (He told me these things over several meals while he was the guest of honor at a science fiction convention I ran.)

Of course in my opinion if he had gone back and edited more his works would have gone from "freakin' amazing" to "sheer and unequivocal genius," so I wish that he had edited more.

To sum: read the first five, spend a few days digesting and basking in the glory of the books, and then read the last five and be amazed in totally different (but still wonderful) ways.
 

For anyone new to thread, this is over six months old and I long ago gave the book back. Though the additional opinions are interesting to read so keep them coming, I could be swayed into giving the second five a try some time in the future.
 


I think my favorite Zelazny novel has to be Creatures of Light and Darkness. I know that most people favor the later Lord of Light, which shares many of the same themes, but I enjoyed the experimental style of CoLaD more. It seemed a bit more distant, a bit more mythic and poetic. Sam, on the other hand, reminded me of Corwin in some ways - he's a wiseass, and we get to see him warts and all.

Even better than the novels are the short stories, though. If you get a chance to read the collections The Doors of his Face, the Lamps of his Mouth, and other stories or The Last Defender of Camelot, try them - they are excellent.

J
 

drnuncheon said:
I think my favorite Zelazny novel has to be Creatures of Light and Darkness. I know that most people favor the later Lord of Light, which shares many of the same themes, but I enjoyed the experimental style of CoLaD more.

Lord of Light was first, at least by publication date ('67 versus '69)

I love Creatures too... it's weird and experimental because he never expected it to be published. :)
 

I don't think you can really compare the two sequences of the Amber novels, as they are two very different types of stories. If you do, the second sequence suffers greatly in comparison, which is unfortunate, I think.

I really enjoyed both, but the first 5 books are definitely more epic in scope than the second, and less bound by technicalities. If anything, I think the two sequences are very good examples of writing to a character's strengths- Corwin, the hero of the first series, is a poetic, somewhat jaded, epic figure- he's not really a hero, but rather someone who ends up in a situation beyond his initial comprehension, but who bulls through it and manages to come out on top by sheer grit and wit as much as ability. His descriptions are more colorful and fantastic than are those of his son, which is perfectly in keeping with the character as revealed to us throughout the course of the series. He is the Bill Shakespeare of the Amber universe.

Conversely, his son, Merlin, is not nearly as eloquent as Corwin. He is far, far younger, and he is both a student of magic and an engineer- and that last portion is sort of his viewpoint on life. He wants to understand the underpinnings of things, how they work, the logic behind them. As a result, the viewpoint that Merlin reveals is far more technical and involved than Corwin's musings and observations. Merlin is deciphering the workings of the Amber cosmos, as are the readers, through him. Like his father, however, he manages to bull through his troubles through wit and talent- not a little of that talent his own magical strengths. Unlike Corwin, Merlin is not adept enough to do things solo, and must rely much more heavily on companions (many of whom have shifting agendas, perhaps even moreso than Corwin's relatives in the first series) as well as blind luck. He may not be entirely successful (at least, some think so) but I think it's pretty evident that the potential to live up to his father's example is there.

In any case, I recommend that you do read them, as well as the short stories that follow if you can find them (and, for anyone who is interested, the book "Manna from Heaven" coming September 30 from Fantastic Book Club, finally collects them all together). Like I said, viewed together, I think the second series (while good) pales in comparison to the first, but if you view them separately, and as character studies of two different types of people, I think both are very strong and interesting storylines.

On the other hand, unless you are a completist, I'd recommend against John Betancourt's "Dawn of Amber". I picked this up in paperback recently, and was underwhelmed. There were some interesting ideas in there, and he works with the Amber cosmology fairly decently, not invalidating or contradicting any of Zelazny's work, but the characters are dull and uninteresting, and some of them just seem off- Dworkin, for one (admittedly, this is set thousands of years or so in the past), and Oberon (the main character) for another. Again, I realize this is a young Oberon (only 24 or so), and much of his development will presumably take place in the course of this series, but he still doesn't strike me as particularly interesting or strong. (He weeps at least once in the book, as does Dworkin... c'mon, this is *Oberon* fer chrissakes!). Unlike the Zelazny works, at least thus far, Oberon has no qualities or personality that can be derived from the first person viewpoint that make him unique... if you changed his name to Caine, or Benedict, or Joe Blow, you'd get the same sense of attachment to the character.

Anyway, hope this helps.
 

Cool Thread

Well I just finished reading the Amber series, and unlike some people I couldnt even pause between books 5+6. I wanted to know more about this universe, this fantastic world.

If you have read Lord of Light then I agree that Corwin ~ Sam. In fact I had read Lord of Light right before the first book of amber and was very underwhelmed and upset to find the same broad themes with the same main character. Of course, in book 2 I was largely over this and by book 3 I had forgotten completely.

Corwin and Merlin are very different. Corwin is brimming with the blood of amber, strong even compared to his siblings (although not the strongest), and he possesses a quick sharp mind. Merlin doesn't seem to be very strong, takes time to process things, and is pretty naieve about some things. I think they make good foils for each other, because while there could have been 5 more books starring Corwin, without a large conspiracy for him to be in, it may have started to get stale.

I think the second 5 books peel away some of the mysteries of the amber universe, which is pretty interesting/exciting. Of course, continuity-wise, one may wonder why the Lorgus and the Pattern weren't actively involved as they are in the second book. After reading the last book I wanted more, I'll tell you that much.

I think Merlin's reign would have been an interesting subject for a book, and there was enough material to go back and do another 5 about Corwin and his current problems. Another thing I have to point out is that I really like how Random's personality developed over the entire series, he is after-all, one of the few constants in the books (in terms of being talked about). I feared Benedict in the first 5 books, but he got barely a mention (or 2) in the second series. Of course, this was to play up a lot of guys from the courts, which is cool. Mandor was rockin'!

As far as plot-holes in the second series, having just read it, I can't think of too many other than Merlin's obvious lack of foresight or picking up on things. He should have had spell hung in preparation for his anniversary every year, he should have noticed a few things about his ex-girlfriend, but other than that I thought it was pretty alright. Deus-Ex Machina was there, but it seemed present in the first series as well, so I think thats more of Zelazny's style than anything else (as it also crops up in Lord of Light).

I haven't read the recent prequel book (although I saw it recently) but for my yearning to know more about Amber I may pick it up. As far as characterization being possibly poor, that may be true, but I think a few of Corwin's brothers suffer similarly. Caine, Gerard, Benedit, Bleys, and even Julian were all pretty similar in my opinion, they only differentiation was their combat style and relative strengths.

Overall, to sum up, I recommend the entire Amber series. If someone is still reading this thread and happened to have some Zelazny links, I'd love to see them. I have his short story series Last Defender of Camelot, Lord of Light, and the book of amber (of course), but anything else would be cool.

Technik
 

Remove ads

Top