The Celestial Slayer - Critique please

[jaker2003]

One of the players in my group is playing a Hound Archon, so I threw this together to make his character memorable by taking on a fiend-worshipping cult.

Celestial slayer
Hey, somebody’s got to kill the boogeyman.
Hit Die: d8

Requirements
Alignment: Any evil
BAB: +5.
Skills: Knowledge (the planes) 5 ranks, Knowledge (religion) 5 ranks, and Survival 5 ranks.
Feats: Track.
Special: Must have made peaceful contact with a fiend.

Class Skills
The Celestial slayer’s class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Bluff (Cha), Heal (Wis), Hide (Dex), Knowledge (religion)(Int), Knowledge (the planes)(Int), Listen (Wis), Move Silently (Dex), Sense Motive (Wis), Spot (Wis), and Survival (Wis). See Chapter 4 of the Player’s Handbook for skill descriptions.
Skill Points at Each Level: 4 + Int modifier.

Class Features
Weapon and Armor Proficiency: The celestial slayer gains no additional proficiencies.
Align Weapon (Su): A celestial slayer’s natural weapons, as well any weapons it wields, are treated as evil-aligned for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction.
Sneak Attack (Ex): As the rogue ability and stacks with sneak attack gained from other classes.
Favored Enemy (Ex): A second level celestial slayer knows his quarry. Due to his extensive study of celestials and training in the proper techniques for combating such creatures, a celestial slayer gains a +2 competence bonus on Bluff, Listen, Sense Motive, Spot and Survival checks when using these skills against outsiders with the (Good) subtype. Likewise, he gets a +2 bonus on weapon damage rolls against such creatures.
At every even level thereafter, the celestial slayer’s bonus against celestials increases by 2. This ability stacks with similar favored enemy abilities.
Sever Soul (Su): A second level celestial slayer may add his Wisdom bonus (if any) as an Insight bonus on rolls to confirm a critical hit scored on an outsider.
Deep Strike (Ex): At fourth level, the celestial slayer gains the benefit of the Improved Critical feat when in combat with an outsider, regardless of the weapon he wields.
Hated Foe (Ex): At fifth level, the celestial slayer’s extensive studies and combat training allows him to gain a bonus equal to his celestial slayer class level on Bluff, Listen, Sense Motive, Spot, and Survival checks when they are used against a particular subtype of outsider. The celestial slayer receives an equal bonus on weapon damage rolls. A celestial slayer may choose one hated foe from the list: Angels, Archons, or Guardinals. This ability does not stack with the Favored Enemy ability, only the larger bonus applies.
No Escape (Su): A tenth level celestial slayer can see the location from where a celestial used a plane shift, teleport, or similar effect within the last 24 hours. Celestial slayers often call this the escape point. A celestial slayer may spend a full-round action opening a portal at the escape point to the celestial’s destination. The portal transcends space and dimension as appropriate, is one-way, and lasts only 1 minute. If a celestial slayer is unable to use the portal before it closes, he may open it again. If a celestial is slain, then a portal cannot be made from its escape point.
Level Base Attack Bonus Fort Save Ref Save Will Save Special
1 +1 +2 +2 +2 Sneak Attack +1d6, Align Weapon
2 +2 +3 +3 +3 Favored Enemy +2, Sever Soul
3 +3 +3 +3 +3 Sneak Attack +2d6
4 +4 +4 +4 +4 Favored Enemy +4, Deep Strike
5 +5 +4 +4 +4 Sneak Attack +3d6, Hated Foe
6 +6 +5 +5 +5 Favored Enemy +6
7 +7 +5 +5 +5 Sneak Attack +4d6, No Escape

 

[Cheiromancer]

I think you need to turn it back a few notches. A fighter's BAB with Sneak attack is quite good. Good skill points more than make up for the "wasted" skill points needed to enter the class. Excellent saves put it slightly over the top. The only drawback is 1 less hp per level than a fighter of the same level, and that doesn't quite make up for the advantages, imho. Still, each die of SA is about a fighter feat, and the saves, being defensive, aren't all that unbalancing. This is about as strong as a base class, so you could add a few feat equivalent powers to balance it as a prestige class.

8 special abilities over 7 levels is too much, though.

A good first step would be to stretch the special abilities over 10 levels. You should also drop about 4 feat equivalents; 1 favored enemy increase, 1d6 of damage, and two saves becoming poor... something like that would be in the right ballpark, I think.

 

[Nifft]

My comments:

- Sneak Attack & Favored Enemy -- both are different expresisons of the same mechanic.

- Since Hated Foe doesn't stack with Favored Enemy, it won't do anything useful ever. Drop it.

- Sever Soul, Deep Strike, free Improved Crit -- again, you're just finding different ways to deal more damage to celestials, which is reduntant. Pick one mechanism and stick with it (Favored Enemy, Sneak Attack, or some other damage bonus). Far easier to balance one thing than to map out all the possible interactions of multiple things.


My suggestions:

- Celestials are highly mobile. They can teleport, dimension door, fly, hover, etc. Taking that away makes them vulnerable in a variety of ways.

- Will is your most important save -- Celestials don't have a lot of explosive reflex powers, nor do they throw a lot of poison, disease, or ability damage at you.

- Smite Good is a fun mechanic for disposable bad guys. Who cares if you only get Smite 1/day, if you only get one attack in your whole life (as an "on-camera" NPC)?

- If you don't go with Smite Good, then I'd suggest Favored Enemy over Sneak Attack. Seems more appropriate for a full BAB class.



Perhaps you could make a variant Ranger instead of a PrC:
Alignment: Must be Evil.
+ Gain Aura of Evil (as an Evil cleric of the same level).
+ Class Skills: gain Knowledge (Planes) and Speak Language (Abyssal, Celestial and Infernal only).
- Lose Wild Empathy / gain Detect Good at will
- Poor Fort save / + Good Will save
- Favored Enemy: Good Outsiders is your only option. You gain +2 vs. Good Outsiders at 1st level, and an additional +2 at 5th, 10th, etc. You never gain additional Favored Enemies.
- Lose Combat Paths. Instead, you gain the following:
+ 2nd level: Your melee weapons (and natural attacks, if any) always count as Magic and Evil for overcoming damage reduction.
+ 6th level: When you crit an Outsider with a melee attack, that Outsider cannot use any teleportation power (including dimension door or plane shift) for 2 rounds.
+ 11th level: Whenever you strike an Outsider with a melee attack, that Outsider's SR is reduced by one. SR returns all at once, one hour after your last strike.
- Lose Animal Companion.
+ Improved Spellcasting: Gain access to all spells on Blackguard spell list (including corrupt weapon), and gain +1 spell slot at each spell level (so 1 spell at 4th level instead of "0").

-- N

 

[Cheiromancer]

One way in which sneak attack might be preferable to favored enemy is that you can use sneak attack even when there are no celestials around. If you are making a class that can be taken by PCs as well (or maybe a fiend slayer variant) it should be able to do *something* outside its focus. Otherwise the player will feel cheated if the current adventure doesn't feature the favored enemy, and the other players will be slighted if it does. Standard rangers can choose several favored enemies which reduces the problem of having a too narrow focus.

Of course, an NPC prestige class can be exquisitely narrow if the DM wishes.

 

[jaker2003]

Hmm, that's a bit to think about.

I always intended to have a fiend slayer class mirror it.
So I want abilities that can be easily reversed . . . I think the above listed mechanics are justly so.