The Epic Game: Character Construction (Phase I)

[Lichtenhart]

Maybe I'm just dense, Zack, but don't you have to take also Dragon wild shape feat to turn into a dragon? Besides, the Dragon you listed aren't colossal anymore, they're colossal+. I think gold reach colossal+ at 50 hd, silver at 52, green at 53 and blue at 54.

That doesn't solve the problem, anyway: what's the point in being a dragon if a druid with 16 HD less than me can turn into a better dragon than me?

 

[Dalamar]

Name still unkown
Outsider (Human) Monk 45/Hero 5
Hit Dice: 45d8+5d4+500 (694 hp)
Initiative: +17 (Dex)
Speed: 250ft, climb 125ft
Armor Class: 65 (+17 Dex, +9 Monk, +16 Wis, +10 bracers, +3 Deflection)
Attacks: Unarmed +47/+44/+41/+38+35 melee; or Flurry of Blows +45/+45/+42/+39/+36/+33 melee
Damage: Unarmed d20+11 slashing+4d6 fire+3d6 sonic (threat range 18-20/x2) (see items)
Face/Reach: 5ft by 5ft/5ft (or 10ft unarmed)
Special Attacks: Abundant Step, Ghost Touch, Haste, Heightened Accuracy (Unarmed), Increased Reach (Unarmed), Ki Strike +3, Quivering Palm, Unarmed Strike, Stunning Attack
Special Qualities: Diamond Body, Diamond Soul, Empty Body, Enhanced Vision, Fast Recovery, Heightened Defenses, Improved Evasion, Inechaustible Endurance, Leap of the Clouds, Perfect Self, Purity of Body, Self-subsistent, Slow Fall (Any distance), Spiderclimb, Still Mind, Timeless Body, Tongue of the Sun and Moon, Water Breathing, Wholeness of Body
Saves: Fort +37, Ref +44, Will +43
Abilities: Str (19) 31, Dex (25) 45, Con (19) 31, Int 25, Wis (23) 43, Cha (21) 41
Skills: 384 skill points before taking into account any of the raises in Int
Feats: Combat Reflexes, Dodge, Expertise, Improved Critical (Unarmed), Leadership, Mobility, Run, Spring Attack, Weapon Focus (Unarmed), Whirlwind
Epic Feats: Epic Speed (x2), Epic Weapon Focus (Unarmed), Exceptional Deflection, Fast Healing (x2), Infinite Deflection, Keen Strike, Penetrate Damage Reduction, Reflect Arrows, Self-concealment (x2), Vorpal Strike

Abilities
Abundant Step: Can Dimension Door 2200ft as a spell-like ability.
Diamond Body: Immune to poison.
Diamond Soul: SR 55
Empty Body: Etherealness 45 rounds/day, need not be consecutive. Supernatural.
Enhanced Vision: Superpowered, persistent. Gained low-light vision. Base cost 2.
Fast Recovery: Superpowered, persistent. Heals twice as fast as normal. Base cost 2.
Ghost Touch: Supernatural, persistent. Unarmed attacks affect incorporeal creatures normally. Base cost 5, -1 reduction because supernatural.
Haste: Supernatural, persistent. Gains an extra partial action each round, doesn't stack with haste. Base cost 12, -1 reduction because supernatural.
Heightened Accuracy (Unarmed attacks): Superpowered, persistent. +3 bonus to unarmed attack rolls. Base cost 1, heightened accuracy x2 (4 points), -2 only affects unarmed attacks.
Heightened Defenses: Superpowered, persistent. Gains a +3 deflection bonus to AC. Base cost 2, increased effect x2 (4 points).
Improved Evasion: No damage on a succesfull Ref save, half damage on a failed one.
Increased Reach (Unarmed attacks): Superpowered, persistent. Increase natural reach by 5ft. Base cost 2, -1 because only affects unarmed attacks.
Inexhaustible Endurance: Superpowered, persistent. Always succeeds in Constitution checks related to endurance. Can never become fatigued, exhausted. Base cost 4.
Ki Strike: Can penetrate Damage Reduction as if attacking with a +3 weapon.
Leap of the Clouds: No limit on jumping distance.
Perfect Self: Becomes an Outsider, gains darkvision 60ft, DR 20/+1.
Purity of Body: Immune to all diseases except magical diseases.
Quivering Palm: 1/week. Duration 45 weeks. Fort DC 48. Supernatural.
Self-subsistent: Superpowered, persistent. Doesn't need to sleep (base cost 1), drink (base cost 1) or eat (base cost 1).
Slow Fall: If within arm's reach of a wall, takes no fall damage.
Spiderclimb: Superpowered, external gadget. Can climb any normal surface automatically. +25 climb. Needs to wear climbing claws (Tiny, AC 17, Hardness 5, 1hp). Base cost 5, -2 external gadget.
Still Mind: +2 saves against spell and effects of Enchantment school.
Stunning Attack: 45/day. Fort DC 48 or stunned. Supernatural.
Timeless body: Doesn't suffer penalties due to age, can't be magically aged.
Tongue of the Sun and Moon: Can speak with any living creature.
Unarmed Strike: Doesn't provoke an AoO when attacking unarmed, Flurry of Blows, can deal subdual damage without penalty.
Water Breathing: Superpowered, persistent. Quite self-explanatory. Base cost 1.
Wholeness of Body: Can cure up to 90hp, supernatural.

Possessions
All Manuals (total 825,000), Gloves of Epic Dex +20 (4,000,000), Headband of Epic Wis +20 (4,000,000), Cloack of Epic Cha +20 (4,000,000), Bracers of Armor +10 (100,000), Vest of Epic Str +12 (1,440,000), Belt of Epic Con (1,440,000)

Fiery Blast, Flaming, Sonic Blast +1 Bracers of Striking (7,841,320)
--Total +14 enchantment
--Counts as a double weapon
--Enchantments gained to unarmed attacks

Leadership (68)
40,000 1st level (1/2 commoners, 1/2 warriors)
4,000 2nd level (warriors)
2,000 3rd level (1,000 experts (spies), 1,000 warriors)
1,000 4th level (clerics with healing domain)
500 5th level (monk 3)
250 6th level (monk 4)
130 7th level (monk 5)
70 8th level (monk 6)
40 9th level (monk 7)
20 10th level (monk 8)
10 11th level (monk 9)
Total of 48,020 followers

Cohort level 39 (monk 34/hero 5)


Details of school kept will be on a different post

 

[Dalamar]

Uh, Zack, you're a 51st level character AND you should've spent the XP to research that epic spell of yours

 

[Lichtenhart]

mmm Re-reading my post above I noticed it could be misunderstood, so I'll make myself clear. Zack you have a wondeful character concept and you made a very good character with it. I just wanted to point out a little imprecision. It's my character who isn't really much more useful now. I'll probably think of something else

 

[Creamsteak]

mmm Re-reading my post above I noticed it could be misunderstood, so I'll make myself clear. Zack you have a wondeful character concept and you made a very good character with it. I just wanted to point out a little imprecision. It's my character who isn't really much more useful now. I'll probably think of something else

See... this is a problem I have with the really high level game. Thier are only a few concepts that work up into epic levels well. For instance, eventually epic mages must cast epic spells to hurt enemies of thier level. It's the only option, because it's the only way they can raise thier Spell DCs faster than a fighter's saving throws... or as fast for the matter.

Saving Throws: +1/2
Ability Score Progression: +1/4
Spell DCs: +1 every 8th level, if you put all stats into Ability Score progression....

So at level 520, the Fighter has a +256 Will Save, Base...

The level 520 wizard, without taking tons and tons of feats particularly to raise his spell DCs, or to raise his ability scores, or taking some prestige class that gets bonus to spell DCs... can only cast an average 9th level spell with a DC of 19+125+20... on average. So the DC doesn't even come close...

Unless the wizard is crunched specifically to raise spell DCs, or doesn't take any bolsterinng otherwise. But what did the fighter do for his protection? Absolutely nothing...

And don't even let me tell you (let alone show you) how much damage an appropriately trained paladin or blackguard can cause in a single attack, compared to average HP at that level.

Crunched to level 500... with a meager 99 feats in Greater Smiting... you can cause 50,000 damage, and if you took an appropriate prestige class, you can do it A FUGGIN LOTTA TIMES PER DAY. I bet I could press the character enough and get the damage up to 100,000 damage... You'd need (on a d8 hd), a 402 Constitution... (though that might be plausable with items...) to counter it. But the paladin next door, who didn't max out on smiting, and tried to be "well rounded" can't cause more than 5000 points of smite damage a round, and although he has a ton of tricks, he has none that can truely deal the damage appropriately.

If high level play "kills your concept" let's talk. There has to be some way to fix it... given some careful adjusting.

 

[Zack2216]

Dalamar:

Uh, Zack, you're a 51st level character AND you should've spent the XP to research that epic spell of yours

How did you get that? 28 levels of druid, 1 level of monk, 20 levels paragon, and 22,600 exp for my epic spell. I changed the information on it as soon as I found that paragon was +20. Just look through it again.

And Lichtenhart, err... I aplogize for ruining your character idea.

 

[Lichtenhart]

ANGEL QUALITIES
Spell-like Abilities: All angels possess the spell-like abilities listed under the half-celestial template (see the Monster Manual, page 213).
Immunities (Ex): All angels are immune to poison, disease, electricity, cold, acid, petrification, and spells and effects of the Enchantment school.
Resistances (Ex): All angels have fire resistance of 20.
Keen Vision (Ex): All angels have low-light vision and 120-foot darkvision.
Summon Angel (Sp): All angels possess the capacity to summon fellow angels. This ability is usable once per day, and is equivalent to the summon monster spell of a level equal to one half the conjuring angel's HD. So, an Angel of the Eighth Order could use summon monster V, because they normally have 11 HD. This ability is usable once per day. Chance of success is a percentage equal to 5 x the angel's HD.
Telepathy (Su): All angels can communicate telepathically with any creature within 100 feet that has a language.
Tongues (Su): All angels have a permanent tongues ability as the spell cast by a 12th level sorcerer.

SERAPHIM
Large Outsider (Good, Lawful)
Hit Dice: 20d8+120 (210 hp)
Initiative: +9 (+5 Dex, +4 Improved Initiative)
Speed: Fly 60 ft. (perfect)
AC: 30 (+5 Dex, +16 natural, -1 size)
Attacks: Purifying flame +25/+20/+15/+10/+5 ranged
Damage: Purifying flame 2d10
Face/Reach: 5 ft. by 5 ft./10 ft.
Special Attacks: Spells, spell-like abilities, summon angel
Special Qualities: Damage reduction 30/+3, SR 32, regeneration 15, angel qualities, immunity to fire
Abilities: Str 27, Dex 20, Con 23, Int 25, Wis 25, Cha 25
Saves: Fort +18, Ref +17, Will +19
Skills: Bluff +28, Concentration +26, Escape Artist +25, Hide +25, Knowledge (any five) +27, Listen +35, Move Silently +25, Search +25, Sense Motive +35, Spellcraft +20, Spot +35
Feats: Cleave, Dodge, Great Cleave, Improved Initiative, Power Attack
Climate/Terrain: Any land or underground
Organization: Solitary
Challenge Rating: 20
Treasure: Double goods; standard items
Alignment: Always lawful good
Advancement Range: 21-30 (Large); 31-40 HD (Huge)

Seraphim, referred to in ancient tomes as the "burning ones," are known to take the form of beautiful serpent-shaped streams of golden fire, from which light emanates in all directions. Seraphs are the angels of love, light, and fire. The Order of Seraphim is the highest order in the Celestial Hierarchy and the elite of the Heavenly Hosts.

Combat
Spell-Like Abilities: At will-bless, commune, consecrate, continual flame, dimensional anchor, dismissal, greater dispelling, holy smite, holy word, improved invisibility (self only), lesser restoration, light, magic circle against evil, remove curse, remove disease, remove fear, shapechange, speak with dead, teleport without error (self plus 50 pounds of objects only) and wall of fire; 3/day-heal, power word (any) and resurrection; 1/day-greater restoration, miracle, and symbol. These abilities are as the spells cast by a 20th level sorcerer (save DC 17 + spell level).
The following abilities are always active on a Seraph's person, as the spells cast by a 20th level sorcerer: detect evil, detect magic, detect snares and pits, discern lies, see invisibility, and true seeing.
Spells: Seraphs have the spell abilities of a 20th level cleric (save DC 17 + spell level) with access to the domains of Air, Good, Fire, Law, and Sun.
Purifying Flame (Su): Seraphim can extend their essence as a stream of sparkling fire to strike any creature within 100 feet of their person, causing 2d10 points of damage to any creature struck. Evil creatures also suffer the effects of a holy smite spell. Those whom the Seraph designates as friendly receive the state amount in restored HP and immediately receive the benefits of a heal spell, looses all negative levels, and regains lost ability scores (the same creature cannot be so affected more than once in a day).
Immunity to Fire: Seraphim are completely immune to fire, magical and otherwise.
Skills: Seraphim receive a +8 racial bonus to Listen and Spot checks.



What do you think of it?

 

[perivas]

See... this is a problem I have with the really high level game. Thier are only a few concepts that work up into epic levels well. For instance, eventually epic mages must cast epic spells to hurt enemies of thier level. It's the only option, because it's the only way they can raise thier Spell DCs faster than a fighter's saving throws... or as fast for the matter.

Saving Throws: +1/2
Ability Score Progression: +1/4
Spell DCs: +1 every 8th level, if you put all stats into Ability Score progression....

So at level 520, the Fighter has a +256 Will Save, Base...

The level 520 wizard, without taking tons and tons of feats particularly to raise his spell DCs, or to raise his ability scores, or taking some prestige class that gets bonus to spell DCs... can only cast an average 9th level spell with a DC of 19+125+20... on average. So the DC doesn't even come close...

Unless the wizard is crunched specifically to raise spell DCs, or doesn't take any bolsterinng otherwise. But what did the fighter do for his protection? Absolutely nothing...

I'm not quite sure that your accessment is correct. Let's talk a look at the 50th level example. Okay, so the save bonus for a 50th level character is around +30.

Now, let's look at the caster's DC at 50th level. Given that the defender did not up their defensive stat, but saved their ability score increases for their own purposes. So, at 50th level, the caster has a 30 in the ability score of choice (18 + 50/4 = 30). That's a +10 to DC. Now the 50th level caster has 19th level spells, as he has level 9 at 20th and plus 1/3 thereafter. That makes the DCs for the highest level spell for the 50th level caster, without feats to be 39 (10+19 for level of spell+10 for ability score). This is not much different than a 1st level caster against a 1st level defender without high stats.

 

[Creamsteak]

I'm not quite sure that your accessment is correct. Let's talk a look at the 50th level example. Okay, so the save bonus for a 50th level character is around +30.

Now, let's look at the caster's DC at 50th level. Given that the defender did not up their defensive stat, but saved their ability score increases for their own purposes. So, at 50th level, the caster has a 30 in the ability score of choice (18 + 50/4 = 30). That's a +10 to DC. Now the 50th level caster has 19th level spells, as he has level 9 at 20th and plus 1/3 thereafter. That makes the DCs for the highest level spell for the 50th level caster, without feats to be 39 (10+19 for level of spell+10 for ability score). This is not much different than a 1st level caster against a 1st level defender without high stats.

But a 50th level character can (and IMO should) buy a +28 cloak of resistance, granting them one hell of a difference there. Then again a crunched wizard can do some crazy stuff themselves, not so much with items, but WAY too much with some PrCs. +1 DC every 5 levels is fine, maybe 4... rarely 3, but when I see +1 DC every other level it drives me nuts.

All this is just IMO though... since I've never played it in action beyond rolling up a battle to decide results.

 

[Kalanyr]

That makes the DCs for the highest level spell for the 50th level caster, without feats to be 39 (10+19 for level of spell+10 for ability score).

The problem with that particular strategy is that it costs Heighten Spell + Improved Heighten Spell feats and taking Improved Spell Capacity each time. This means that the most damaging spell with this DC does 25d8, with a Fort save for half. Now, Fort vs Fighter is never a good choice, assuming the fighter saves a mere 3/4 of the time, not at all unreasonable, the average heightened horrid wilting inflicts 70 points of damage on the fighter. Now even if this is changed to a ref save and the fighter flubs every time its still a mere 112.5 on average. Not gonna bother a 50th level fighter much if at all.

Also playing a diety is becoming more pathetic the more levels over Divine Rank 1 you dump into it, unless you dump all your stat points in charisma and do insane divine blast damage and have a *frickin* high AC. And even this requires a mere one divine rank.