D&D 5E The Martial/Magical scale

Klaus

First Post
Just out of curiosity, let's rank the 5e classes on a scale from "Purely Martial" to "Purely Magical". I'm setting the "Magic Level" at 0 for Purely Martial, and increase from there.

0 - Fighter (Champion and Battlemaster), Rogue (Thief, Assassin)
1 - Barbarian (Berserker)
2 - Monk (Open Hand, Shadow)
3 - Monk (Elements), Fighter (Eldritch Knight), Rogue (Arcane Trickster)
4 - Paladin, Ranger, Warlock (Blade)
5 - Warlock (Chain)
6 - Cleric (War, Tempest), Bard (Valor)
7 - Cleric, Druid,
8 - Warlock (Tome), Bard (Cunning)
9 - Wizard, Sorcerer

Taking both Magic Initiate and Ritual Caster feats moves you up one point on the scale each. Being a Mountain Dwarf moves you down one point, and being a high elf, tiefling, or aasimar moves you up one point.

So, thoughts? Corrections? Comments? Let's hear 'em.
 
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I would move shadow monk up with elemental, and put war college bard with druid/cleric, then put the other bard up with wizard at 10... Barbarian path of totem should be somewhere around 3-5 as well. I don't understand why being a dwarf moves you down.
 

Pickles JG

First Post
I think you have the non caster rogues and fighters, the 1/3 casters, the half casters amd the full casters as 4 bands.
Monks and barbarians are as magical as 1/3 casters. Warlocks are effectively full casters but may fall between half and full. Any of cleric bard warlock or druid who take their multiple attacks path or generally melee are maybe a notch down but not as far as the half casters. Monks maybe push to half caster level -not sure I'm speculatimg.

Of course it depends what you mean by magic/martial. Amount of abilities that use the game rules for magic or extent to which they break physics or something else.
 

steeldragons

Steeliest of the dragons
Epic
Why are the War and Tempest clerics "less magical" than the rest? I get that they get armor and martial weapons. But, for on scale "how magical", they receive just as many spells. They do just as much channeling. Yes, they can wear other/"more" armor and use other/"more" weapons...but all clerics use armor and weapons. It's a part of the class. The amount of "magic" they have/can use is the same as other domains.

I'm going to presume that the martial weapons and heavy armor, by your scale, is saying they are somehow "more martial" than other clerics...and I don't know if I would agree with that. Does it make the class more inclined to go running into battle, thus more martial? Or is that an attribute or assumption to be made on a character level, not a class level?

This conversation may benefit from definitions, before it moves too much further, of what you are scaling/"grading" on that constitutes more/less "Martial" and "Magical".

From where I sit, the spectrum is "Martial uses no magic" <---exactly in the middle, "Uses Magic in equal measure with Non-magic abilities" ---> "Uses only magic."

I don't know if I could granulate down to individual 0-9 points. But, for my two coppers, the classes would be (Note: as I want them, not as they are!)
- Fighter (Champion, Battlemaster), Barbarian (Berserker), Rogue (Thief, Assassin), Ranger (Hunter).
- Barbarian (Totem Warrior), Ranger (Animal Companion guy)
- Fighter (Eldritch Knight), Rogue (Trickster), Paladin, Monk (any)
- Bard
- Cleric, (maybe Blade Warlock as well)
- Druid, Warlock
- Wizard, Sorcerer

EDIT: In an attempt at clarity/to avoid argument, there is a subjective element in gaging what a class can "do" vs. what they "have [access to]." There are, of course, no "right" answers...other than non-casters, obviously, at one end and "full" casters on the other, with "partial/"half" casters and those with magical abilities" somewhere in the middle. /EDIT
 
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Klaus

First Post
I would move shadow monk up with elemental, and put war college bard with druid/cleric, then put the other bard up with wizard at 10... Barbarian path of totem should be somewhere around 3-5 as well. I don't understand why being a dwarf moves you down.

A Moutain Dwarf's proficiencies with Light and Medium Armor, Hammers and Axes makes any character "more martial", as I see it.
 

Pickles JG

First Post
That's only the case if they use those abilities. A mountain dwarf paladin is exactly as magical as any other. I also think there is enough variation in the way you build and play the middle ones that 10 bands is trying too hard to split things that overlap.

The druid in my party is exactly as magical as the wizard unless you count his infrequent shillellagh attacks as making him more martial. The same could apply to a bard. While an elf wizard could use a bow to better effect than cantrips at low level making him more martial not the reverse.

Subject to definition ofc.
 

Saeviomagy

Adventurer
Yeah, not seeing how being a warlock, a class who's every ability is granted them by an evil magical patron, counts as at all martial and anything less than 100% magical.
 

Ruzak

First Post
I like it. Of course not every combination of race and works out perfectly, but I think it provides a nice view of the landscape.
 

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