The monk. It will be mystical most likely

[Plane Sailing]

I'm hoping for a mystic monk - in a generic sense; I'd rather not see it associated with ki or psionics.

However, if it is - no worries. I'll just change my definitions

 

[Plane Sailing]

A literary example of the kind of thing I've got in mind is the blood guard of the Thomas covenant books.

 

[Steely_Dan]

A literary example of the kind of thing I've got in mind is the blood guard of the Thomas covenant books.

Yes, I mentioned the Bloodguard (Bannor etc) as a prime example of non-Asian/Oriental Monks; in 3rd Ed I made a Monk/Ranger that was based on the Bloodguard.

In my Planescape campaign I have Drow Monks as ongoing antagonists, and there is nothing "eastern" about them at all.

 

[Plane Sailing]

Yes, I mentioned the Bloodguard (Bannor etc) as a prime example of non-Asian/Oriental Monks; in 3rd Ed I made a Monk/Ranger that was based on the Bloodguard.

In my Planescape campaign I have Drow Monks as ongoing antagonists, and there is nothing "eastern" about them at all.

Sorry, somehow didn't notice that you'd mentioned them.

Interestingly, in Unearthed Arcana Monte had a 'Oathsworn' class which was completely inspired by the Haruchai (if I remember their name for themselves correctly).

 

[Minigiant]

Many characters from 2D fighting games that are not from the eastern part of Asia could work as monks as well.

You could easily reimage many Capcom and SNK characters to fit into D&D without too much work. T Hawk and Elena (Street Fighter) are easy. It would be quite funny to be able to plop Medieval versions of SNK bosses as BBEGs.

 

[Lord Mhoram]

A literary example of the kind of thing I've got in mind is the blood guard of the Thomas covenant books.

One my favorites (as you could probably tell by my username).

I loved the Oathsworn in Monte's Aracana Unearthed. Obviously the "Bloodguard" class without an Asian feel to it.

 

[Mattachine]

In Forgotten Realms there are several well-described orders of monks, based on the D&D monk class (rather than on Asian mysticism). Greyhawk also has a couple established orders of monks.

Monks might not fit in some folks pseudo-Medieval homebrew, but they are established in many campaign worlds.

 

[ArmoredSaint]

My first ever PC was a Monk. AD&D, 1st edition, first printing, right out of the Player's Handbook. It has been a part of D&D for almost as long as there has been D&D; it predates the original Oriental Adventures sourcebook by six years. Not only has it been a part of D&D for longer than I have been playing D&D, it has been a part of D&D since before I was born.

Be that as it may, Gygax is on record (in an early issue of Dragon magazine) as saying that he wishes he hadn't put it in the game, and later wished that he had saved it for the later Oriental Adventures book.

I am in agreement with him. I do not care about the monk's long history with the game. It hasn't ever fit in, and it never will. Removal of the default, vaguely Euro-Medieval/Renaissance feel from the cultural assumptions of the core game will result in something that loses that classic D&D feel that they're trying to recapture.

The inclusion of the monk was a mistake, and it's one I'd like to see corrected in this edition, though I doubt it will due to the horrid class's regrettable and deplorable popularity.

 

[Abstruse]

In Forgotten Realms there are several well-described orders of monks, based on the D&D monk class (rather than on Asian mysticism). Greyhawk also has a couple established orders of monks.

Monks might not fit in some folks pseudo-Medieval homebrew, but they are established in many campaign worlds.

Only difference is someone did the mental gymnastics for you. Pretty much everything in D&D (at least the core idea) is based around European tropes. Fighter, cleric, wizard, thief, barbarian, paladin, ranger, etc. are all either universal concepts or strictly Western. Monks, however, are strictly Eastern in style. There is no other class which has an innate mystical capacity for combat because that idea is firmly rooted in the concept of ki/chi/qi, which is an Eastern ideal. Even in Greyhawk, FR, etc., monks still have "monk weapons" which are almost always purely Eastern - nunchaku, sai, tonfa, etc.

Next should do its best to divorce that cultural identity from monks. It should still be available to play, but it shouldn't be the only identity monks have. Let a monk use daggers instead of sai, a mace instead of nunchaku, a rapier instead of butterfly swords, throwing daggers instead of shuriken, etc. They're already using a quaterstaff instead of "bo", so why not go with it?

 

[Gold Roger]

Be that as it may, Gygax is on record (in an early issue of Dragon magazine) as saying that he wishes he hadn't put it in the game, and later wished that he had saved it for the later Oriental Adventures book.

I am in agreement with him. I do not care about the monk's long history with the game. It hasn't ever fit in, and it never will. Removal of the default, vaguely Euro-Medieval/Renaissance feel from the cultural assumptions of the core game will result in something that loses that classic D&D feel that they're trying to recapture.

The inclusion of the monk was a mistake, and it's one I'd like to see corrected in this edition.

But this is not an universal statement. For me, trying to chop down D&D to fit a Euro-Medieval/Renaissance feel will lose that classic D&D.

We should have the option to use a class many love and expect from the start. I don't want to wait for two years, as in 4th edition.