D&D 4E The problem I've having with 4e.

[Nom]

Here's the key disconnect:

If the game mechanics are a "simulation", then every event that happens in the game mechanics has a specific analogue in the game world. There's aggregation, certainly (the "critical hit" might be to the eye or to the gut), but the point is still a 1:1 correspondence between the mechanic and an instance of some class of in-game event.

However, that's but one way of viewing things. It's entirely possible to tell two parallel stories of the events without one being an analogue of the other. Under this model, specific "narrative" events don't have to correspond with specific "game mechanic" events. Narrative events may occur that do not feature in the game model, and game model events occur that do not feature in the narrative.

Game model, a "healing surge" is a mechanic that allows a character to draw down on his long-term hit point reserve into the current battle. But that doesn't mean that either concept needs to be represented in the narrative. Narratively, the character simply "isn't defeated yet". It's completely legitimate to say that "Tom huddled defensively for a moment while planning his next move"; the narrative doesn't need to know that Tom used his "second wind" action to gain a defensive boost and simultaneously upped his current hit point total. It also doesn't care that he actually stayed huddled for two rounds, only 1 of which used a "second wind" while the other used some other defensive mechanic.

It's quite acceptable for the narrative and the game mechanics to hide details from each other: "don't you worry about that".

 

[FitzTheRuke]

I don't much like that either. Can anyone confirm that it was removed?

Seems like speculation to me based on it not being included in the 5 page D&DXP rules primer.

Personally I'm going to assume that the DDI articles stand until the actual books tell me otherwise, or a designer mentions that they've changed it.

Fitz

 

[Toras]

As I see it, the original question included the 'will the 4e rules include IC justifications for the OOC rules' clause. Regardless of the heroic work some are going through to provide that IC justification, we can't know the answer until the rules come out (barring a leak somewhere). I look at the rules and say to myself "Looks like that could be justified. I wonder how good a job they'll do." I then move on, because there's nothing more to say until I see the books.

--Penn

This was about what I was going for. I had not kept up with such things as well as I should, but I was largely wondering if such things had been already shared. IT seems that if they shared the reasoning it would help to diffuse some of the controversy that these sorts of things are causing. (aka throwing those of us in the slightly less Cinematic side a bone, though the fact that I find myself arguing that side is odd for once, as I am often a stunt/cinematic junky. My continuing enjoyment of running Feng Shui and the effect that's have on my DMing style seems to prove it.)

I suspect the ring thing bothers me, less for the level requirements (as personal power as a requirement for using an item doesn't bother me, though I would like it to have lesser effects on those who are not strong enough or at least the option for such things). I only wonder why just rings. The idea in and of itself is of merit (though it will lead to MMORG references for sure). I would have preferred if it was a type (rather than slot) of item as well. But again these are more minor quibbles and would require only a little bit of IC justification.

As a slight thread deviation, it has occured to me that if we were to take healing surges as the actual spontaneous healing of wounds it would add a rather interesting tack to the game. Making the fighter slightly less an Aragon, and a bit more of a Jason Vorhees in play. But it would be an interesting concept to explore from psuedo-horror angle. I'd likely require a name for what the PC's are (make a phenomina, but it would certainly lend to some rather interesting story fodder) And it would work as a justification for a number of the most esoteric things.

 

[smathis]

More like pro rasslers...


Imagine, if you will...Chief Jay Strongbow is in the ring with Nikolai Volkoff...

Color me impressed by your knowledge of personalities of one of my favorite eras of Rasslin'.

 

[smathis]

The most common way I've seen them described is basically a heroic surge of willpower, shrugging off injury. It's like characters in alot of movies that get shot or badly wounded and all seems lost but then, through great resolve, they get up and fight almost as if they were never injured.

That's pretty much how I explain it too.

If it helps the OP, think about it this way...

Every time Conan says a sentence or makes an exclamation using the word "Crom" in the REH stories, he's burning a Healing Surge.