The Rod of Seven Parts: Kauai Team OOC

[Ambrus]

Its great when walking around with a reach weapon and someone jumps at you with surprise.

Personally, I prefer not having someone jump on me regardless of what I'm carrying.

 

[CanadienneBacon]

My understanding is that deflect arrows does not work when you are flat-footed. Is there any way to affect when you are flat-footed? Barbarian dodge only gives you back your dex and combat reflexes let's you make AoOs while ff. I was thinking of getting combat reflexes anyway, would that be close enough for deflect arrows to kick in? If not is there any other way?

What is it, exactly, that you're wanting to do? Knowing what it is that you want will help me decide if it's acceptable.

While I wait for you to address the question above, I'll go ahead and comment on the questions you asked me last Friday.

I see nothing at all in either the flat-footed or the deflect arrows feat description that would prevent a PC from using deflect arrows while flat-footed. If you know of some rules text that would prevent you from using the feat while flat-footed, let me know. After reading the rogue entry for uncanny and improved uncanny dodge and seeing that those special abilities don't keep you from being flat-footed but only grant you your Dex bonus when flat-footed, I don't know of any way for a character to truly prevent being flat-footed. Prior to reading up a little bit this morning, I had thought there was something in the rules that would allow a PC to not be flat-footed, but if there is I wasn't able to find it today. Maybe someone else knows of some core rule that would be helpful?

I'll tell you a secret...I haven't been counting PCs as flat-footed at the start of a battle before they get to their initiative. About the only time being flat-footed works in my games is if you're caught surprised.

 

[Voadam]

The highlighted portion of the srd entry for deflect arrows.

DEFLECT ARROWS [GENERAL]
Prerequisites: Dex 13, Improved Unarmed Strike.
Benefit: You must have at least one hand free (holding nothing) to use this feat. Once per round when you would normally be hit with a ranged weapon, you may deflect it so that you take no damage from it. You must be aware of the attack and not flatfooted.
Attempting to deflect a ranged weapon doesn’t count as an action. Unusually massive ranged weapons and ranged attacks generated by spell effects can’t be deflected.
Special: A monk may select Deflect Arrows as a bonus feat at 2nd level, even if she does not meet the prerequisites.
A fighter may select Deflect Arrows as one of his fighter bonus feats.

 

[Voadam]

Its a minor point really.

Maelicent winged a rock at Voadam when Voadam couldn't see him.

I thought it would be cool to catch or deflect the rock with his highly trained combat skills. Similar to the way I see happen occasionally in a bunch of samurai comics like Usagi Yojimbo or Lone Wolf where the hero is meditating but senses an attack and stops it when an assassin jumps them.

But then I re-read the full text of the feat and don't think it can work that way under RAW.

As I understand it if Voadam is flat-footed or unaware of the attack he cannot deflect the thrown rock with the feat.

I know of no way not to be flat-footed before combat other than high perception skills and good initiative.

Some conditions come close, barbarian and rogue uncanny dodge at level 2 can keep your dex when flat-footed. Combat reflexes allows you to take AoOs while flat-footed.

I was planning on taking combat reflexes later anyway for flavor reasons (combat oriented and martial art trained) and wondered if you would let them have synergy for this type of situation which is similar but not an exact match.

Ultimately it only matters mechanically if somebody ambushes Voadam with a missile weapon. I'm fine with a ruling either way though.

I'm not going to multiclass into barbarian or rogue (wizard for Voadam after 1st), but I was planning on picking up combat reflexes at either 3rd or 6th level.

 

[CanadienneBacon]

Thanks, I missed that even after reading the first quote and then again while reading the PHB. If it'd been a snake, it would've bit me.

What is it, exactly, that you're wanting to do? A specific question would give me a better chance at a concrete answer to satisfy you either way.

From the way you've phrased things, it seems like you want to take combat reflexes, then deflect arrows, and don't want to be flat-footed at the start of the round if your initiative comes up lower than the monsters'. Do I have that right? If so, I've already let you in on the secret that I haven't been (and am not likely to start at this stage) using the rule that characters are supposed to be considered flat-footed at the start of combat before their init comes up in the count, which may serve to make your concern moot. Other than that, about the only other time you'd be considered flat-footed might be on a surprise round. You can mitigate surprise by taking ranks in spot and listen. I don't know of a way to get rid of surprise entirely. If you do, please share.

Will taking combat reflexes and deflect arrows allow you to use deflect arrows while flat-footed? Not per the RAW as far as I can tell. Combat reflexes, per the SRD, allows you to react on instinct and grants an AoO while flat-footed. That's a whole lot different than using it for a defensive maneuver. Best I can tell, saying otherwise would be a house rule and one that I'm not likely to make.

But, again, if none of that was what you were wanting an answer for, then please do let me know.

 

[CanadienneBacon]

Ah, okay, now I understand. We were posting at the same time just there. Yeah, no, I don't think combat reflexes will let you deflect arrows at the start of combat. But I'm open to anyone's rules interpretation that says otherwise.

 

[CanadienneBacon]

Ambrus, having failed a will save, Maelicent should be affected by the forest's doom spell and applying a -2 to attack rolls, saving throws, skill checks, and ability checks. I also am uncertain why you have Maelicent's initiative listed as +5 on his character sheet when his Dexterity is 18 and I don't see anything else that would boost it up. Perhaps I missed something?

 

[Mista Collins]

I think I saw a feat somewhere in a core book that allowed you to act first before being surprised. Maybe it was a class feature. Maybe it was a d20 Modern ability. But I remember seeing it and thinking...that's interesting.

 

[Mista Collins]

ahhh. Now I know where I saw it. There were two things I recalled dealing with acting first in a round, and they are as follows:

Sudden Action: Once per day,a Bodyguard of 4th level or higher can force his or her effort to burst into sudden action when the situation calls for it. The Bodyguard can change his or her place in the initiative order, moving higher in the count by a number less than or equal to his or her class level, as the Bodyguard sees fit. The Bodyguard can declare the use of this ability at the start of any round, before anyone else takes action.

The first comes from the Bodyguard advanced class in d20 Modern. Really wouldn't apply even if it were written for D&D. No help there.

React First: Starting at 2nd level, a Negotiator gains the ability to react first when trying to make a deal or mediate a settlement. The Negotiator must make contact and speak to the participants prior to the start of combat. If he or she does this, he or she gains a free readied action that allows the Negotiator to make either a move or attack action if either side in the negotiation (other than the Negotiator) decides to start hostilities. The Negotiator gets to act before any initiative checks are made, in effect giving him or her the benefit of surprise.

This one comes from the Negotiator advanced class in d20 Modern. Again, it wouldn't apply to what you are looking for even if it were written for D&D. Again, no help.

I just knew what you were trying to accomplish reminded me of some sort of rule I saw somewhere. I figured it was probably d20 Modern as I've been reading over those for two campaigns I just started.

 

[CanadienneBacon]

Thanks. Maybe that's where I saw it too.