The Supplement Treadmill vs. The Alternatives

[rounser]

I'm not sure that this is actually true. Many RPG companies only make RPGs, or make them as their primary business. I think. White Wolf have published one or two card games, but their house is built on RPGs. Eden does only RPGs. Mongoose, Paizo, probably a lot more. Outside of the d20 world I'd bet most companies only do RPGs because it's all the have capital (if not interest and expertise) to do.

Time and again someone in the know (usually Ryan Dancey) points out that WOTC/D&D for all intents and purposes is the only significant company in RPGs, that it more or less is the RPG industry, which means that except in RPG industry terms, White Wolf is probably absolutely tiny.

It seems likely to me that Magic: The Gathering has made more money since it's release than the entire RPG industry has in 30 years. I may be wrong, but there's a long way between selling the odd RPG book and the licence to print money that M:tG appears to have been. Remember, M:tG and Pokemon CCG effectively bought D&D, not the other way around.

 

[kolikeos]

None of the above. I choose not to buy any of that stuff. I've already GOT the game, so whether they stay in business or not is their problem, not mine.

QFT

 

[buzz]

Eden does only RPGs. Mongoose, Paizo, probably a lot more. Outside of the d20 world I'd bet most companies only do RPGs because it's all the have capital (if not interest and expertise) to do.

Mongoose does minis games as well as RPGs. Paizo sells all kinds of products: RPGs, accessories, boardgames, t-shirts, etc. Eden... I'm not entirely sure how well they're doing.

Mongoose claims that they make the majority of their money off of RPGs, and I have no evidence to suggest otherwise. Of course, they are undisputed kings of the supplement treadmill.

Hero Games is one of the few traditional RPG-only companies I can think of, and even they are starting to branch out into fiction publishing, not to mention have recently made a number of cost-cutting measures.

 

[JustinA]

The equivalent to those things isn't a whole chapter but, say, an NPC, a building, an adventure hook or plot idea, which are generally (I think) no less easy or easier to adapt.

Possibly true. However, the feat, spell, or class can be:

(a) Used by both the player and the DM; and

(b) Used over and over and over again without any risk of anyone ever saying, "Haven't we been in this building before?"

Both of those factor directly into the perceived utility of a given supplement.

When I assess the value of a supplement there are three questions:

(1) How much of this is worth using? (i.e. has acceptable quality)

(2) How much of this will I use? (i.e. is applicable to my actual game)

(3) How often will I use it?

 

[RFisher]

And if the lines are wholly separate (as GURPS and Munchkin would appear to be) presumably you'd want both to make money.

I didn't say RPGs should be loss-leaders. Just that a well-rounded company can't expect every product line to be as profitable over the long-term as every other product line. Just because you have one product line that's doing very well (Munchkin) doesn't mean that you should kill any products that aren't making as large a profit (GURPS).

Although, in my last post, I forgot to reiterate my second point on this topic, which is sizing. SJG (to continue with the example) isn't trying to grow bigger than what their products can support. Being a profitable RPG-only company is possible, but a big part of it is being very lean & mean.

 

[buzz]

Being a profitable RPG-only company is possible, but a big part of it is being very lean & mean.

A good way to accomplish this is to not expect to make a living doing it. The odds of doing so are not good.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

I was just talking to a FLGS manager- according to him, SJG is apparently shifting resources from GURPS to Munchkin- a decision apparently dictated by sales trends.

Not good.

 

[buzz]

I was just talking to a FLGS manager- according to him, SJG is apparently shifting resources from GURPS to Munchkin- a decision apparently dictated by sales trends.

Not good.

1. I'd take his info with a grain of salt.

2. If it keeps SJG in business, thereby keeping GURPS alive, then more power to them.

 

[Chiaroscuro23]

Mongoose does minis games as well as RPGs. Paizo sells all kinds of products: RPGs, accessories, boardgames, t-shirts, etc. Eden... I'm not entirely sure how well they're doing.

Mongoose claims that they make the majority of their money off of RPGs, and I have no evidence to suggest otherwise. Of course, they are undisputed kings of the supplement treadmill.

Hero Games is one of the few traditional RPG-only companies I can think of, and even they are starting to branch out into fiction publishing, not to mention have recently made a number of cost-cutting measures.

Well, the list is pretty intimidating, but we can check here (if we're unreasonably motivated) http://www.pen-paper.net/rpgdb.php?op=publisherlist for publishers to see what all they do. Eden, I should note, also does an RPG-related magazine and RPG-related fiction. Don't know if that disqualifies it or not.

I apologize for being wrong about Mongoose and Paizo, though I've never seen any Paizo products at the FLGS other than magazines and gaming books. I guess they sell their T-shirts at cons or on their website or something?

 

[RFisher]

Well, the list is pretty intimidating, but we can check here (if we're unreasonably motivated) http://www.pen-paper.net/rpgdb.php?op=publisherlist for publishers to see what all they do.

You want intimidating...

AN ENCYCLOPEDIA OF ROLE-PLAYING GAMES

(He doesn't have direct links to his publisher listings, which are broken up by first letter. You can find them by clicking on a publisher's name in the main listings.)