D&D 5E The Un-Setting: the Default Core World in 5e

[P1NBACK]

Don't be hyperbolic. I'm not saying that dungeons shouldn't be a highlight of the game, I'm saying that the setting of a "dungeon" does not appeal universally, and shouldn't be the assumption of play to the point where they waste a huge chunk of the DMG on it. Dungeons should be side-by-side with wilderness, urban, marine and airborne adventures.

Yeah, I'm not being hyperbolic. You said dungeons should be the focus of a supplement or something called "Dungeon Building Guide" or whatever.

My point is that, the DMG should be the ultimate Dungeon Building Guide. There hasn't been a truly robust, definitive guide to building dungeons, and in a game about dungeon delving, I would think D&D Next would be the best possible place to insert that into the DMG.

If "marine" adventures have to be relegated to supplement status because we need more space for methods and tools for creating badass dungeons, so be it. The game isn't called Oceans & Dragons.

Besides that, if a dungeon is this place you spend all of your time, they cease to be special.

I disagree. And, I bet the thousands of players who's campaign is set entirely in a mega-dungeon would disagree too. That's the awesome thing about dungeons. As Zak S says (careful, NSFW), I can't imagine getting bored of dungeons.

p.s. Zak S is consulting for 5E... So, here's to hoping his ideas on dungeons seep into the 5E design ethos.

 

[Incenjucar]

Plenty of people do get bored of dungeons. Sadly, D&D has a long history of having middling support for folks who like to play in wide-open spaces. Still, settings like Planescape, Dark Sun, and Spelljammer have had a lot of open sky-friendly material, and 5E might gain some ground with people it has been missing from the fold if they actually started paying attention to the world above more.

Imagine how boring LotR would be if they spent the whole time in the dwarven ruins instead of crossing sweeping vistas on horseback or defending mountain strongholds or crossing perilous swamps on the way to sky-darkening volcanoes.

 

[Doug McCrae]

I very much like the idea of the 'perilous location' - ancient ruins, a cave system, an enchanted forest, an underwater temple, etc. However I've always had major suspension of disbelief trouble with one aspect of the traditional D&D dungeon - far too many mutually antagonistic monsters living too close together.

In B2 The Keep on the Borderlands, for example, I can't believe that so many tribes of 'savage humanoids' who seem to mostly be at odds, would live side-by-side. Even more implausible, is that they would be happy to live near the gray ooze and owlbear in the Shunned Cavern. In real life, top predators such as prides of lions have large territories, and stay clear of one another. Human tribes are the same. If the savage humanoids in B2 couldn't slay the ooze and owlbear they would leave the area, imho.

So, although I like many aspects of D&D, count me as someone who dislikes dungeons.

 

[Doug McCrae]

As a player, I want to see your DM vision of the setting- not some random hodge podge of whatever people bring to the table.

But... that's what D&D is, historically. It grew by accretion, the work of many hands.

 

[Janaxstrus]

Plenty of people do get bored of dungeons. Sadly, D&D has a long history of having middling support for folks who like to play in wide-open spaces. Still, settings like Planescape, Dark Sun, and Spelljammer have had a lot of open sky-friendly material, and 5E might gain some ground with people it has been missing from the fold if they actually started paying attention to the world above more.

Imagine how boring LotR would be if they spent the whole time in the dwarven ruins instead of crossing sweeping vistas on horseback or defending mountain strongholds or crossing perilous swamps on the way to sky-darkening volcanoes.

Honestly...watching them trek through dwarven dungeons would have been 87% more interesting than watching them walk everywhere (and occasionally jogging)

 

[Doug McCrae]

Still think that you're running the world of "Yes"? And if no, how do you draw the line?

In my last campaign, a player created a whole galaxy, a Warhammer 40K ripoff, from which his PC originated. I was cool with that, in fact I really enjoy that kind of thing. The campaign world becomes a shared creation. It's more collaborative.

It was a superhero game, in the Marvel/DC-style so very kitchen sink-y and able to accomodate all sorts of craziness. D&D has traditionally been kitchen sink also, and hence resistant to crazy, though many GMs do like to tone down the default level of wahoo. Even then, player-generated content may be fine, provided the players have a reasonable level of sensitivity to the GM's vision.