Third Edition Culture- Is is sustainable?

[Turjan]

Don't hold your breath. WotC believes some of those key design elements (classes and levels, in particular, which would negate a point-buy evolution) are keys to the success of D&D versus other systems. It may seem like a logical progression to you, but in that case, you're better off progressing (logically, no doubt) to another system.

From a business standpoint you are probably right. If WotC dropped classes and replaced it by an open point-buy, this would be the end of all those supplements cramped with new prestige classes .

 

[Henry]

Not quite. First of all, D&D was *far* more mainstream in the early 80's than it is today. There were D&D action figures at Toys R Us, and even a D&D Saturday morning cartoon, for goodness sake. Second, D&D has *never* been hip and cool, and probably never will.

Perhaps you're thinking of X Box?

What you call "mainstream" I call "faddish." All the things you describe are qualities of faddishness - the inundation of a brand-new concept in multiple media venues, much like pokemon a few years ago, or Yu-gi-oh now.

D&D is not mainstream now, certainly, but about as mainstream as participators in extreme sports. Millions of people have played back then, and no longer continue to play; now, you only play if introduced by a friend or incidental purchase, and like all pasttimes only a fraction make it a dedicated hobby. Like NASCAR, I've known fans from the 1960's in the hobby, as well as people who have only followed it through its more faddish phase of the last five years; after the chrome of the new-ness in public eye fades, only a small percentage will follow it thereafter, not much larger than the percentage who followed it before it hit big-time.

 

[Mystery Man]

From a business standpoint you are probably right. If WotC dropped classes and replaced it by an open point-buy, this would be the end of all those supplements cramped with new prestige classes .

Which in turn, would put them out of business.

 

[Turjan]

Which in turn, would put them out of business.

Which was exactly my point !

 

[Storm Raven]

Which in turn, would put them out of business.

No, they would just switch to providing supplements that were filled with point buy options (like new advantages and benefits), and prefabricated point buy builds. Which is basically what SJGames does with GURPS.

 

[Mystery Man]

No, they would just switch to providing supplements that were filled with point buy options (like new advantages and benefits), and prefabricated point buy builds. Which is basically what SJGames does with GURPS.

Merely supposition but I think the general audience would go away since PRC's and Feats sell books. I'm crazy not about that BTW, nor do I state it as fact. DnD is more popular than BURPS for a reason.

 

[Doug McCrae]

No, they would just switch to providing supplements that were filled with point buy options (like new advantages and benefits), and prefabricated point buy builds. Which is basically what SJGames does with GURPS.

SJGames has also published approximately one billion world books for GURPS.

 

[Psion]

Feats, I can take or leave. I enjoy some feat expansions, but I think I could live without ever adding another one to my game.

(Well written, conceputally rich) Prestige Classes, OTOH, I could buy till the cows come home. They are more than just mechanics, they are concepts that you can plug into a game. And I dig that.

 

[Narfellus]

Not quite. First of all, D&D was *far* more mainstream in the early 80's than it is today. There were D&D action figures at Toys R Us, and even a D&D Saturday morning cartoon, for goodness sake. Second, D&D has *never* been hip and cool, and probably never will.

Perhaps you're thinking of X Box?

Don't quite agree with that, Sebastian, in all humbleness. I DO think DnD is more popular than it has ever been. Instead of cartoons, we have feature films (which are also bad) COUNTLESS video games, commercials, movie star endorsements (Vin Diesel?) and multinational consumer brand name recognition. It has been elevated from the trenches of a "satanist" game into a socially accepted, indeed, as someone else mentioned, Faddish game. And that's what bothers me, because i don't like fads: not clothes, not music, not games, and not Pokemon. But i do like DnD, even though it's a fake fad because it's old as heck and has just gotten noticed by the new kids.

 

[Rasyr]

Oh? (Askance stare). I know you want to promote your baby, but I think you are losing sight of the fact that these are still individual preferences. It might be fair to say that there are some people would find aspects of your game appealing, but don't go off thinking that because lots of people share things they dislike that the all hold a substantial portion of them.

No, I am not losing sight that these are all preferences. I firmly believe that no single game can fully meet the individual preferences all the different gamers out there. This also means that some games are better than others, under the proper circumstances, as no game can be perfect for everybody.

And please note that while, yes, I do want pimp my baby, I was very careful not to actually mention it in my last post. And I still haven't mentioned it by name in this post either. I have mentioned it in other posts, but normally only in illustration of a point.

For example, I am the one who brought up BAB as a skill. But you can pry spell slots out of my cold dead hands.

ROFLMAO!!!! That was good.. hehe

As I said upthread, what game is "right for you" is a balancing act between which attributes of a game you like versus those attributes you can put up with.

True! But I also believe that folks should know that there might be other viable options for them. For example, look at the post die_kluge made. There was a LOT of changes he wanted, as for others, it may only be something small. However, if die_kluge found a system that is closer to his preferences for an ideal system, should he not check that system out?

You forgot something as in that statement, I think. It should be:
"a balancing act between the attributes you like, the attributes you dislike, but can put up with, and the attributes that you can not put up with"

That last bit has to be part of the equation as well....