Those groups where no one ever dies

[tec-9-7]

I agree 100%. Why bother putting much effort into your character when you know he'll be dead within a few weeks? The fun is seeing your character advance, potentially from 1st-20th level.

I'm with you on this - character death is fine as long as it's reasonably rare.

Rolling up a new character every level or so isn't fun; it's monotonous and boring.

I'm with you here too - especially in 3.0/3.5 - rolling up a new character was quick and painless in OD&D - not too much harder in AD&D - I can't speak to 2nd ed. as I never played it - but in the newest incarnation it's enough of a PITA that I don't want to do it too often (esp. if I'm supposed to make up a mid-level character).

If I was joining a new campaign and the DM told me to roll up 4 characters in case of death, I wouldn't even bother to show up; it would be obvious to me that the DM isn't setting up the encounters properly.

This is where I'm not with you. The only way an encounter isn't set up properly is if it is both overwhelming AND there is NO WAY for the players to avoid it. This notion that all encounters must be scaled to the abilities of the PCs rubs me the wrong way.

 

[The Human Target]

Well,it seems everyone has an opinion, so I suggest you simply decide where you stand on the issue of PC death,tell your players, and go for it.I like the chance of death,because to me the dnager creates some of the fun.But as a DM iv'e yet to kill someone off, and I think it's made my games to safe, so my next game session starts with a very fatal battle. It isn't assured someone will die, and I won't fudge the dice, but it's a possible. I say you should think about house ruling the Rasie dead type spells to make them more expensive, or switch to a more lethal death means death RPG.

 

[tec-9-7]

FWIW, I'd say that rather than trying to change existing 'safe' campaigns, you (as DM) approach your group and just say that you'd like to begin a new campaign w/ no kid-gloves. Making a long-term safe campaign suddenly into a lethal campaign is IMO a recipe for disaster, and it's x 10 if you arbitrarily decide to do this w/o discussing it w/ the players.

 

[LazerPointer]

I know I said "I wanna kill PC's;" that was poorly worded. I'm with a lot of you who say that having the possibility there makes the game more rewarding, but I certainly don't want to design stupidly hard, unavoidable encounters. I don't really want to roll the dice out in the open, either, cause I want to be able to cover my @ss if I put them in over their heads. I don't want one of our group's first deaths to be getting run over by a cart or something.

In the other two campaigns there's been one death, which was remedied immediately because the cleric had prayed for a miracle.

The idea of having a close NPC bite it first appeals to me, cause then they could find out that there won't always be a noble cleric or druid at hand.

I haven't designed a lot of my homebrew, and the Pantheon and history are only roughly sketched, but I was thinking of making a 'gate of the afterlife' situation to roleplay. something where, based on a character's interaction with whatever gatekeepers are their for their race, their soul could be consigned to realms that are beyond resurrection or they could be ressurected then and there. with strings attached, or a 'mantle of destiny' rationale.

I think this would definately favor certain races, (the pantheon is not healthy) and perhaps the characters who know they have goals beyond the next inn or fight. Wouldn't be fair, but maybe mentioning it in the handout-to-come would prepare them for it.

 

[Ogre Mage]

PC death

I would just say flat out that the possibility of PC death is real in your game. I would qualify this by telling them that you will not deliberately try to slaughter the PCs, but you will not pull their fat out of the fire either.

I believe PC death should be legal but rare. It certainly is true that constant slaughtering of the PCs ruins any and all character development. But if there is no danger of dying at all, the game gets boring. Finding a balance between the two is actually not that hard.

 

[painandgreed]

All during college I played ALOT of D&D (5 ongoing campaigns in my best semster grade wise, 3 of which played during finals week) and we rarely had PC deaths. We had them but then again PC resurrections or raises were even rarer. We still had the odd high body count game and enjoyed it. Usually, the Dm would always make us roll up two PCs each because "so that your new character will have some experience once your main one dies." We were all good with it and switching to a backup character softened the blow of PC death. Tell them it will be dangerous and if they balk, then rethink it.

 

[swrushing]

but now that I'm DMing, I wanna kill PC's.

show your players this post before they spend one minute in chargen.

any of them who decide to stay, they deserve what they get.

if it were me, i would thank you for your time, politefully, say something warm and fuzzy about differing styles and expectations, and walk then run as i head for the hills.

EDIT: BTW, i did once have a GM, after i handed him a character with background, tell me not to get "too attached" as the character would probably die soon and i ought to have a backup. I did indeed thank him for his time, retrieve my character and leave politely on the spot.

 

[Ry]

Some people will adjust to this better than others. So, you might want the first character death to be a little less than 100% random. So, perhaps you might want to skew risks towards the characters of players who are more emotionally mature and capable of handling this.

Ideally, if you want to ease people into this, the first death shouldn't be random at all but instead kill off the character of someone who is a little tired of him or her.

I disagree with this; nobody, and I mean _nobody_ wants to be pressured or forced to lose their character. Even if they're more mature, and aren't that happy with their character, if the player in question feels like they're being picked on (or forced into a decision) then don't be surpised if they get mad. Because it's D&D, we can see a lot of the unexpected; so it can easily show if you're trying to off one PC rather than balance an adventure against a whole party.

I agree with the others; let them know straight-up that death is more of a possibility, that you won't pull punches, and that if TPK should occur, that they'll just have to suck it up and roll new characters. They'll tell you if they can't handle that, but with 2 other DMs running never-die games, the variety should be fine.

But try to be fair; if the players get wise, and start being much more cautious in your games, don't go after them just to get those deaths. I can't imagine that would feel fair on their side.

 

[Creamsteak]

Coup de Grace one of your players, Have an improved invis assassin do an assasination attemp on one of the players. Nothing says you mean business than trying to assassinate a player. Even if they survive the attack they know you mean business.

Obviously. But if they don't survive... well... it gets harder and harder to find new players as aweful "rumors" start to spread.

 

[Arbiter of Wyrms]

Let me chime in with the majority. Talk to your players. Warn them of the danger. After all, nothing ventured, nothing gained. Without the threat of loss, investment is a waste and a bore.

I've played in campaigns where character death was not a possibility. Our 3rd level party took on great wyrms with divine ranks and their storm giant minions and by the end of the evening, we all went home happy and fully healed with our +6 flaming holy vorpal scimitars of speed and true seeing. It was boring. there was no risk and no investment. Worst of all, I couldn't take those characters to another DM's game because they were broken.

In the game I run, I tell players right off the bat that I don't wear kid gloves. Foolish or reckless players should not get attached to their characters. I'm fair, but it's a brutal game and they're only fictional characters.

The funny thing is that players do invest in their character and in the campaign, and PC death just happens to be very rare. I don't have to bend over backward to save PCs. Players are prudent and conservative and their PCs live. Yet I still have a reputation as a killer DM, a fair DM, and a good DM.

It might be that none of these reputations are fair, but I'm still proud of them all.