D&D 5E Those who come from earlier editions, why are you okay with 5E healing (or are you)?

Oofta

Legend
It's not just the extremes that are stretched to the point of snapping by 5e. Lets say you do slow natural healing, now martials are at a disadvantage to casters who get everything back & can go full leroy jenkins with their spells tomorrow. If you do the not so gritty "gritty realism" there are a ton of spells that become pointless or just hindered & you have to walk a fine tightrope trying to balance the needs of short rest classes vrs long rest classes... that's all before you factor in how many abilities, magic items, & spells are nonsensically pegged to days rather than rests. Any "simple" fix quickly proves to need more fixes. It's possible to tweak the dial one notch, but not three or four because zeus & ares just don't fit into gritty, survival, horror, mere heroic, etc unless you make them mortals by stripping them of their powers & set them against cosmic horrors.

That seems like a whole bucket list o'complaints only some of which are related to healing.

In previous editions, you had to rely more on magical healing. That meant more wands, potions or days where you did nothing but cast healing spells and then rest again until you got spells back. Casters that tried to adventure without a tank or two in the party generally regretted it quickly.

Nothing else has really changed all that much. D&D has never really been designed to be particularly gritty or realistic, it's been designed to be relatively easy to play and fun. I think 5E is far easier to morph into different styles of play than some previous editions, but no game can cover all bases.

As far as changing rest periods to longer durations (which I think is one of your complaints), I do that in my own campaign. It took about 10 minutes to type up a house rule telling people that all spells that had a duration of more than an hour had their duration multiplied by 5. Anything that renews daily renews weekly.

It's easy, simple to implement and works for my purposes.
 

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It's not just the extremes that are stretched to the point of snapping by 5e. Lets say you do slow natural healing, now martials are at a disadvantage to casters who get everything back & can go full leroy jenkins with their spells tomorrow.

Depending on how far you go. I do not put martials at disadvantage. It's a matter of careful balancing. As I said earlier, I (we) want heroes, not cartoons.

If you do the not so gritty "gritty realism" there are a ton of spells that become pointless or just hindered & you have to walk a fine tightrope trying to balance the needs of short rest classes vrs long rest classes... that's all before you factor in how many abilities, magic items, & spells are nonsensically pegged to days rather than rests.

I think my fix did just that. Remove automatic full healing and use HD instead. Everything else is unchanged and it works out quite well.
 

Chaosmancer

Legend
Some people can still have fun with it. Other people come to this thread, to answer the question being asked, about why they can't enjoy it.

I think it is fair to say that after 400 some posts, we have moved beyond people simply stating their positions.

You're the one who said that nobody took 1E seriously, so why should anyone take that into consideration? If you don't care, because you aren't taking it seriously, then your opinion (on what it is that is specifically working against narrative consistency) is irrelevant. Because, as you stated, you don't care.

And that's the running theme, throughout 5E, and especially in its healing rules: It's fine if it doesn't make sense, as long you're only playing with people who don't care.

Ah, I see. You are taking the point too far.

The point is not a lack of care, as in "I could care less" the point is a matter of focus and resources.

I never said no one took 1E seriously, the very fact that the game ballooned into a worldwide phenomena with multiple worlds, at least one TV series, multiple movies (animated or otherwise) and a hefty novelization library would put such a notion immediately to rest. Obviously people took the game seriously if they were passionate enough to create so much more

However, the focus was never on realistic simulations of a fantasy world.

The Funhouse dungeon where monsters with no ecological reason to were all crammed together, simply because it was a more interesting fight, shows us this. A game that wanted to simulate a real world with real monster habitats that naturally fall from the abilities and evolution of the monsters would not have that.

The sci-fi elements thrown in for the amusement of the players, allowing medieval knights to interact with cleaning robots from a spaceship show us this. In a game that was firmly rooted in a single genre of high fantasy, especially as it was understood from mythology, would likely not have been so blatant and such elements would have been far reduced, leaving us only the technology of the Middle part of the Middle Ages.

But, just because the game has never been focused on perfectly simulating a real, high fantasy world, does not mean no one cared, or no one brought forth these elements. In fact, often times they help make much more interesting and coherent stories. I truly enjoy figuring out how monsters fit into the world, where they would arise, how they would interact with the environment. But, this can also be a problem for me, because then the monster populations are either too small to be a proper challenge (I once ran a game where most of the gameplay took place in an Empire, and because having dangerous monsters roaming the countryside is bad for an empire, the players almost never encountered any monsters at all.) or far too numerous to ever fight through (I also ran a game where an entire island being settled was packed to the brim with various monsters, I had to stop having random encounters, since traveling for a week through the jungle would lead to multiple fights a day, and we did not have the time out of game or the resources in game to have that many fights just traveling to the plot important location)

And, I would never come to the forums and complain that DnD 5e does not properly set up and layout monster ecologies... because that isn't the focus of the game. The game is not meant to simulate a real world. It is a game.

And that is how I see HP. It is not that I do not care about HP, simply that focusing on realistic portrayals of injuries, lingering wounds, broken bones, and recovery times is not something the game is built to focus on, and the amount of work I would need to put in to change that, and the amount of additional fun it would bring to the players, it is not worth it to me to focus on it either.

IF we examine it too closely, does it seem wildly inaccurate and unrealistic for the story? Yes, of course it does, and we might or might not come up with explanations that we like for our own internal consistency. But the energy I could spend focusing on analyzing how long it should take for my character to recover from being cut by a greataxe wielded by a Frost Giant (an attack which in the real world would probably be instantly deadly no matter what due to the sheer force of the blow likely rupturing internal organs) I could instead spend figuring out more fun crafting rules, or rules for running a village, things my players want me to focus on, because they will allow them to explore new and interesting stories that wish to explore.
 

Fanaelialae

Legend
It's not just the extremes that are stretched to the point of snapping by 5e. Lets say you do slow natural healing, now martials are at a disadvantage to casters who get everything back & can go full leroy jenkins with their spells tomorrow. If you do the not so gritty "gritty realism" there are a ton of spells that become pointless or just hindered & you have to walk a fine tightrope trying to balance the needs of short rest classes vrs long rest classes... that's all before you factor in how many abilities, magic items, & spells are nonsensically pegged to days rather than rests. Any "simple" fix quickly proves to need more fixes. It's possible to tweak the dial one notch, but not three or four because zeus & ares just don't fit into gritty, survival, horror, mere heroic, etc unless you make them mortals by stripping them of their powers & set them against cosmic horrors.
5e is very forgiving to modding. If you changed to slow healing, likely all that would change is that the players would quickly figure out that a healbot PC/NPC is mandatory once again. Rests would become 1-2 day affairs where the cleric (or whatever) spams CW / prayer of healing over and over. Just like in the old days. Certainly not my cup of tea, but it's not going to break your game any more than it did for previous editions.

And yeah, it puts martials at a disadvantage and makes them reliant on a healer for recovery of an important resource - still just like previous editions. Presumably if you want to return to the slow natural healing from previous editions, you ought to be willing to accept the baggage that comes attached to that.

In game design, as with many other things, there is almost never one true perfect solution. Rather, there are tradeoffs, each with their pros and cons. Ideally, you arrive at an implementation with all the pros you want and cons you can accept.
 

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