three new turning ideas

[Pyrex]

Pyrex: Once again, a neat twist. I'll have to think about that one, although it gives some interesting options. It does keep the all-or-nothing aspect, however, as it's still a save-or-effect.

Yeah, as a 'save-or' effect, that means it's possible that not the entire group of (say) zombies will be affected. Some will save, some won't; eliminating one of the 'all-or-nothing' aspects.

And it also increases the list of possible conditions from two (Destroyed/Turned) to three (Destroyed/Paralyzed/Repelled). The 'Repelled' condition keeps things interesting against undead BBEG's by letting the cleric do *something* without letting him end the encounter on round 1.

The next key is that it eliminates the additional 'turning damage' roll in favor of making the Cleric work for it.

The HD comparison breakpoints might need tweaked though.

 

[Kerrick]

I meant to pop in here the other day and weigh in, but I got sidetracked and forgot. Here's a system I came up with last year. I had many of the same problems with the system that you've got now, so I worked to fix those, then spread out to cover all the rest of the little things to make it all work as a whole. This system uses Turn Undead as a feat, and undead make a Will save to resist. With a turn attempt, you can rebuke undead (making them cower instead of flee - picture the old vampire movies where the priest holds up his cross and the vampires hiss and hide their faces and maybe move away a bit, but don't flee), or actually turn them (which makes them flee - great for getting them away from a dying comrade); and you can make an energy burst (good clerics only) that does damage to undead in a 30-ft. radius. This system also works with other creatures that are turnable by clerics (elementals, lycanthropes, plants), but obviously some of the effects won't work there (like the energy burst).

And for some reason I forgot about bolstering undead. :\ I'll have to go over this again and revise it a bit, but it'll give you some ideas anyway, I think.

 

[Sigurd]

Undead should need Unhallowed Ground

The problem with turning is that there should be another dimension to the game Corruption\contagion\ichyness etc... Undead should pollute the ground they walk upon and expend their power to travel and corrupt ground. Clerics should be able to hallow a space (for a while) and drive them from it.

A vampire or ghost cannot enter hallowed ground. Vastly different power levels but the same result. Vampires would have higher corrupting powers but the same weakness. If a cleric could overcome the corrupting power and make it impossible for an undead to escape to unhallowed ground then, it should be destroyed.

 

[Pyrex]

That's a really nifty idea. Now how do we make it work?

1) Any stretch of ground has some sort of (Un)Holiness rating.

2) Undead with HD+TurnResist of <= Holiness can't enter that square

3) When the Holiness rating of the ground they are standing on changes,
Undead with HD+TR > Holiness are unaffected.
Undead with HD+TR <??> Holiness are Turned and Flee towards the nearest area of lower holiness
Undead with HD+TR <??> Holiness are Destroyed.

4) Based on some function of HD+TR, Undead "un-holy-fy' the ground around them, reducing the Holiness rating by X every Y time units.