• The VOIDRUNNER'S CODEX is LIVE! Explore new worlds, fight oppressive empires, fend off fearsome aliens, and wield deadly psionics with this comprehensive boxed set expansion for 5E and A5E!

To RP Game Players/Gamemasters -- What is Fun? What is Unfun?

Silvercat Moonpaw

Adventurer
pat%20on%20head.gif
Okay, make that: "Sticking a player with a character with a character based upon something they can't control without telling them beforehand that they shouldn't decide what they want to play until after the random elements are done is really sucky."
 

log in or register to remove this ad

Psion

Adventurer
Okay, make that: "Sticking a player with a character with a character based upon something they can't control without telling them beforehand that they shouldn't decide what they want to play until after the random elements are done is really sucky."

Hmmmm. Should I really answer this, knowing it will derail the thread into a clone of one I've had many, many times?

Let's just say that while I accept that's your preference, I find there are methods that have most of the advantages I see in point buy and few of the multiple drawbacks. It's not my preference.
 

Glyfair

Explorer
It's intriguing, but the site is hard to navigate, and the setting books are too expensive for my tastes at the moment. It's a good idea, though.

Glorantha is the FRP where the world is mythic. On the other hand, the early stuff is the best. The modern Glorantha reads like it was written by a group of fans who have been studying the minituia and insisted on including as much as possible. Find a group who knows the old school Runequest feel and then you have a great campaign world.
 

S'mon

Legend
11. The modern mantra of "All PCs are special little snowflakes who should only die at appropriate time."

I agree, when it comes to D&D in particular - the game is fundamentally balanced around risk/reward and the absence of risk of PC death removes that element. You can run a non-PC-death game, and I have done so (using Fate Points) but I did find it less fun, though excessive PC death is not much fun either. I think to do it successfully in D&D would require a very different approach than the standard D&D; in a high-fantasy quest type campaign like Dragonlance, or a high-concept setting like Midnight, it should work better than in a typical loot-the-dungeon campaign.

Conversely, there are plenty of other RPGs where "PCs are special, no (or very rare) PC death" works fine. Buffy the Vampire Slayer RPG comes to mind; OGL Conan to a lesser extent. Partly it depends on the genre you're emulating.
 

S'mon

Legend
Fun: Players who contribute interesting setting details and cool PC backgrounds.

Unfun: Players who tell me their PC has a katana which does 2d8 damage. At 1st level. And shoots harpoons for x4 crits. And tell me what the Craft DC to make it was, and that they made all their rolls pre-game. And tell me the new crafting system rules they've created so their PC can make uber items. And then post to the group message board that they have this 2d8 katana without consulting me. Please tell me your ideas, but leave the mechanics to the DM.
 

S'mon

Legend
[Challenging the players within the scope of the game. Fighting them as hard as I would fight in any wargame and seeing them succeed. That look on the players' faces after encounters when they've survived something they know might well have TPK'ed 'em and the dawning realization that they won by dint of luck and skill.

This is something I enjoy a lot. Although I don't exactly 'wargame' the NPCs unless they're brilliant tacticians; smart critters like drow or duergar maybe. With orcs and goblins, I play them in-character; dangerous but intellectually limited. I ran an orc squad with panthers on Saturday vs the PCs. The PCs were holding a narrow doorway. The orcs sent in the panthers first to soften them up; then when a gap opened up the big orcs drove the small weak orcs in first, soaking up the AoOs of the defenders so the little orcs got cut down and the big orcs behind were able to move in over the corpses and pour into the room. At that point the orcs got massacred; they'd already lost too many men & panthers. The last orc ran away; a PC tracked him down and finished him off. But it was fun getting into the mindset of orcs and running them appropriately, and doing my best - as an orc - to kill the PCs.
 

S'mon

Legend
-Relative balance at all levels of play for characters. Our 3.5 games tended to be low-level affairs (don't know that I ever played above level 10, personally, and we rarely got above level 5 or 6), and I rarely played wizards because of it.

A Wiz-5's fireball stacks up pretty well against anything the other PCs can do, in my experience. I remember a tough fight vs gnolls at a wintry frontier outpost, many years ago - the PCs were struggling; then boom and charred gnolls everywhere...
 

Campbell

Relaxed Intensity
Fun
  • An engaging character driven narrative
  • Being able to play a diverse array of character concepts
  • Meaningful decisions (moral, strategic, tactical)
  • Mechanics that serve to engage players in the game's narrative without getting in the way.
  • Players that are actively engaged in a game's narrative and setting.

Unfun
  • Being force fed a particular narrative (Adventure Paths).
  • False choices
  • Passive players or GMs
  • Relying on randomness when it doesn't serve to increase dramatic tension.
  • Failure without consequences.
  • Success that isn't meaningful.
  • Mechanics that serve to unnecessarily constrain outcomes.
 

GlaziusF

First Post

This thread is apt to show edition-specific divisions, because our modes of thought about what makes good or bad gaming have been framed by the edition differences.

Or because we play one edition instead of another because we can do more fun things in it?

Yeah, I know, that sounds crazy. Everybody knows game system choices stem from fundamental moral failings and corporate brainwashing.


Settings that read like they came out of myths and stories. I actually don't think I've ever encountered this one, but it's a dream of mine.

It's funny you should mention that. I have a player who can basically freestyle settings. I have no idea how he does it, but he's great at it. He came up with a convincing story for as near to a minmaxed death machine as he could come up with - a bugbear ranger with twin frost scimitars, Wintertouched, Lasting Cold, Scimitar Dance and the Storm Warden prestige path. His village is suffering from a terrible drought, so he is out questing in pursuit of the myth "Strong Legs Tames The Storm", which for you Glorantha people is exactly what you think it is.

So every so often I will run one complete sidesession combat which is him and the other players reenacting a scene from the myth in the spirit world. I asked everybody a couple of questions at character generation including "what is your character's favorite animal?", so he turns into Strong Legs and everybody else turns into their "spirit animal" forms. The paladin is an otter in platemail brandishing a giant rock on a stick, the warlord is a giant owl, the cleric is an unassuming deer whom every animal in the world is pledged to protect, the wizard is a hawk surrounded by perpetual winter, and the starlock is a space dolphin.

The one fight I've run so far was the story of how Strong Legs tamed Storm's hunting-wolf, Lightning, when for sport it was flushing the Six Prey and, when Strong Legs and his companions killed them, was impressed and decided to follow him. Though I described it in those terms, it was mechanically identical to the ordinary characters fighting six heavy warhorses that just trampled them repeatedly with a hazard representing Lightning, who bites anyone who looks at him. Basically I locked everyone "facing north" at the start of combat, and if you use a move action to move other than shift or teleport (both of which let you pivot), or attack in a direction you're not facing, you're assumed to have met Lightning's gaze, and he jumps you, +4 vs. Reflex, 2d4+1 lightning damage. (Or something along those lines, I haven't got my notes on me.)

But yeah, we all took a break from the normal run and talked in the third person past-tense instead of first person present-tense, and turned all the attack powers into hyper mythic equivalents, so freezing cloud was basically Fimbulwinter and burning hands from the starlock's wand was a giant meteor strike.

I don't think I could run an entire campaign along those lines, because it requires a certain improv-friendly mood, but it was a fun sidesession.
 

FUN:

1) Fast moving action without getting bogged down in rules.

2) Interacting with NPC's with minimal dice rolling spoiling the encounter.

UNFUN:

1) Player:" Wait a second.................one, two, three, I attack this guy......."

DM: "You can't move there. Thats a corner, you have to go like this -one, two, three, four, but then you are subject to two OA's, unless you do this..........."


2) Player: " You need to let us in! The Duke ordered us to report to him personally as soon as we had any new information."

DM: " OK roll vs bluff skill."

Player: " But we are telling the truth!! "

DM: " Alright roll vs Diplomacy then."
 

Voidrunner's Codex

Remove ads

Top