Traps up to level 30 ?

[mmu1]

I dunno, really high-end traps always mess with my suspension of disbelief.

They're hugely expensive, complete overkill against 99% of threats, will probably fail to stop high-level intruders anyway, and just waste resources that generally speaking could be spent on more common-sense but less flashy security measures. It's like playing NWN and running into traps with a disarm DC of 40 because the character is 20th level - it reminds you of how artificial the game mechanics can be.

High level play has so many ways of getting around normal restrictions on movement anyway that trying to funnel PCs into traps is much more trouble than it's worth, short of lame DM fiat that just tends to make for frustrated players who don't appreciate being forced to dungeon-crawl like they were still 3rd level.

 

[Xyl]

The designers have mentioned that traps and environmental dangers will be part of complex encounters, just like monsters. A level 30 trap will be something that can substitute for one monster out of five in an encounter for a level 30 party. That means that all it has to do is be able hinder a party who are involved in a tough battle, not be a challenge all by itself. Some examples could be an antimagic field, an area-effect disjunction trap, or a constantly shifting field of prismatic walls - while they aren't likely to kill by themselves, they can certainly make combat more difficult.

 

[Celebrim]

http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=910060&page=2
I really wonder what a level 30 trap will look like ? Something involving a anihilation sphere ?

A magical sensor within a lead lined unhallowed room containing a dimensional anchor goes off if anyone gets within 30' of a certain container (in which is a widget that the characters needs. That sensor opens a trap door in the roof of the room, while simultaneously all exits in the room are shut with adamantine faced blocks of stone 10' wide. In the first moment, a Greater Dispelling trap goes off in the room. Simultaneously, the trap door opens onto a perfectly smooth vertical shaft 100' long which contains in its upper 50' antimagic field, and its lower 50' a disjunction field which severes magical spells (as the spell disjunction). The upper end of the shaft is connected to the plane of vacuum, and has a large razor sharp fan. These devices act to rapidly begin sucking the air from the room with superhurricane force - lifting up any object weighing less than 500 lbs and hurling it up the shaft unless a successful reflex check (to grab something) and climb check (to hold on) can be passed. An additional climb check is needed each round of the suction (which last 5 rounds until the room is emptied of air). Characters that can fly can subtract thier fly speed from the 120' per round that they would normally tumble in the direction of the fan/portal. Halfway up the shaft there is a constellation of spheres of anihilation which require a tumble check to evade (penalty based on size of character). If these are evaded, the character can try to grab the fan (reflex check + climb check to hang on), but if sucessful takes falling damage as of a fall of 120'. Whether successful or not, they further automatically suffer a +40 melee attack from the fan blades (6-72 damage, 19-20/x2 crit). A further climb check is required each round that the portal is open (5 rounds). Those sucked through find themselves on an airless plane. Those not sucked through, then must hang on or fall (120') plus must evade the spheres of anihilation on the way down and pass a second time through the disjunction field.

The room remains a vacuum until breached (explosively). This normally occurs after 6 hours.

In the first round after the trap goes off, a dozen highly advanced wraiths rise to torment the characters.

 

[frankthedm]

High level play has so many ways of getting around normal restrictions on movement anyway that trying to funnel PCs into traps is much more trouble than it's worth, short of lame DM fiat that just tends to make for frustrated players who don't appreciate being forced to dungeon-crawl like they were still 3rd level.

High level play had so many ways to get around those in 3E, yes. Those days are over. Remember, there are no assumptions that the party has a caster who can cast X, Y and Z anymore. Heck it stands to reason many abilities assumed to be possessed by level 15 in 3e, won't even show up until after 25th, if at all, in 4E. The game won’t stop being Dungeons and Dragons at higher levels, which will be a welcome thing after 3E’s upper levels practical being Spellcaster Superheroes or at best Dungeons, then Dragons.

 

[LightPhoenix]

I think the issue mmu1 is bringing up is believability of traps.

I could see a big bad specifically designing a trap knowing the PCs are coming. However, those types of traps existing in a dungeon simply because the PCs are level 30 is stretching the imagination.

Now, if play style is such that everyone overlooks it, there's nothing inherently wrong with it, I think.

However, I agree with mmu1 that "dungeon" (really any dungeon-like thing) crawling needs to change over time with the PCs. Part of that is that traps simply stop being hinderances, unless they're specifically designed by a big bad (or whatever) to stop the PCs.

 

[blargney the second]

Rocks fall, everyone dies.

 

[Rechan]

I think the issue mmu1 is bringing up is believability of traps.

Well you have to ask yourself "What would be building a trap that would challenge 30 level PCs?"

I don't think PCs will be fighting 26th level goblins in their tunnels, dealing with Really Scary pit traps. They should be, well, raiding the Demonweb pits and such-like. And I would expect something that's capable of going toe to toe with a party of that level would have traps that would obliterate something of a smaller level.

After all, Mr. Balor doesn't have to worry about 10th level characters storming his abyssal fortress, because 10th level characters wouldn't survive. But he's got to be able to smoosh those that would be able to tackle the standard denizens of the Balor's fortress.

 

[olshanski]

CR30 trap=

Chew-Z. God promises eternal life. We can deliver it.

 

[Frostmarrow]

The laser trap in that corridor in Resident Evil movie.

That is a nasty one! How the trap teases the victims into thinking "hey, I can reflex save this" and then go

"No, you can't."

 

[Li Shenron]

I really wonder what a level 30 trap will look like ?

Just scaled up damage and attack roll.