Traps up to level 30 ?

[Rechan]

I just hope they severely reduce costs for traps. The multi-thousand gold piece costs for a hole covered with leaves were just completely stupid.

This.

Although, in all honesty I just ignored them.

 

[frankthedm]

Well, I certainly hope you're wrong, because that's essentially a summary of ways of wreck the game as far as I'm concerned.

You can HOPE I'm wrong all you want. Lots of folks, sometimes myself incuded, dearly wish I misread the writing on the wall. The real issue is; Based on what WotC has said, do you suspect I am wrong?

 

[mhensley]

Really Nasty Pit Trap

CR 30; mechanical; location trigger; automatic reset; DC 40 Reflex save avoids; 200 ft. deep (20d6, fall); poison (dragon bile, DC 26 Fortitude save resists, 3d6 Con/0); Search DC 45; Disable Device DC 45.

 

[Cbas_10]

Epic-level dungeon-crawling? Because nothing says "You're 20th level!" like yet another 5' wide corridor... If I wanted to do that, I'd play WoW.

I haven't agreed with a sentiment more than this one in a long time. We will see some serious quality if the designers don't treat the experience as 30+ levels of dungeon-crawling. High level traps should start to really mess around with the PCs' heads. Illusions that trick them or misdirect them from plot points...enchantments that alter the PCs or the environment around them. Or even sending them to other places. Something beyond..."Ohh...high level trap...deals an unholy Pant-load of damage!" *yawn*

 

[WyzardWhately]

Or, for the Kult/4E crossover that I'm thinking about running...Your entire life, everything you love, and the whole world. That's the trap.

Seriously though, 30th level traps should be weird and scary, not simply huge with higher DCs. I mean, a sword popping out of the wall..that's cool, for low to mid-levels. But if twenty levels later you're saying, "It's a poisoned hellsword powered by adamantine clockwork, so the numbers are higher." Ugh. And, yes, the pit covered in leaves and stocked with Pungi spikes shouldn't cost more than an expensive suit of armor. Jesus. Where were goblins getting that kind of money?

So, hell, a 30th level trap to me should be, like, hose-pipes spewing green slime everywhere right before the iron golems bust out of the walls like Kool-Aid Man. Or a machine that gates in from the shadowfell the restless spirits of all your past victims as one massive welded-together undead.

 

[Moon-Lancer]

That is a nasty one! How the trap teases the victims into thinking "hey, I can reflex save this" and then go

"No, you can't."

RE4 had a even better lazer trap omho. Although it doesn't hit impossible wall mode, it is more cinematic.

 

[Rechan]

Remember that traps in 4e aren't just 'it's a sword that pops out of the wall'.

They're multi-round traps that fill an entire room. They're designed to function as a monster, meaning instead of having 4 monsters in an encounter, you could have 2 traps and 2 monsters. Which means the trap needs to be a steady threat until it's taken out.

Secrets of Xen'Drik had a few of them. One was a chamber that, once entered and triggered, the door sealed shut and jets of fire burst out of holes in the wall for multiple rounds.

Another, spikes thrust out of every square in the room for five rounds, essentially getting an attack against anyone in the room. You could attack each square on the floor to disable that square, or you could try to cross the room to the control panel to disable the entire trap.

 

[WyzardWhately]

Remember that traps in 4e aren't just 'it's a sword that pops out of the wall'.

They're multi-round traps that fill an entire room. They're designed to function as a monster, meaning instead of having 4 monsters in an encounter, you could have 2 traps and 2 monsters. Which means the trap needs to be a steady threat until it's taken out.

Secrets of Xen'Drik had a few of them. One was a chamber that, once entered and triggered, the door sealed shut and jets of fire burst out of holes in the wall for multiple rounds.

Another, spikes thrust out of every square in the room for five rounds, essentially getting an attack against anyone in the room. You could attack each square on the floor to disable that square, or you could try to cross the room to the control panel to disable the entire trap.

These sound pretty cool, so long as they don't break suspension of disbelief. They would, in most circumstances. At least in my campaigns. And, y'know, I would like for there to still be a place in the system for the classic 'hole covered in leaves' or a tripwire tied to a crossbow. I mean, we need low-rent traps that dungeon-trash like kobolds and goblins could conceivably build, not just crazy cinematic The Cube style stuff.

Unless we use Living Dungeons. Then, hell, go hog-wild.

 

[Rechan]

These sound pretty cool, so long as they don't break suspension of disbelief. They would, in most circumstances. At least in my campaigns.

I think the philosophy behind the traps is that they're not just a one-shot deal to make you waste a cure spell. They're supposed to be Big, Flashy, Cinematic and Cool, and that everyone in the party can get involved. The fighter can attack the source of the attack (smashing the pendulum blade), the wizard could Slow the flames being shot out, etc.

To me, such big gawdy things make more sense as you go up in level, but make less sense for low levels. I just don't see the goblins in the cave down by the river having an entire "room" engineered to kill stuff with big fancy mechanisms. Unless they're engineers or the cave used to be a dragon's cave, it's just not going to make sense to me.

 

[blargney the second]

I just don't see the goblins in the cave down by the river having an entire "room" engineered to kill stuff with big fancy mechanisms. Unless they're engineers or the cave used to be a dragon's cave, it's just not going to make sense to me.

Man, defensive chokepoints with hazardous obstacles? Goblins'd be all over that like a fat kid on a Smartie.
-blarg