D&D 4E Trauma and damage in 4e

[Puggins]

I'd coopt the death/dying rules.

When you go negative:

Each round, make a save:

1-9: you've suffered a serious wound. You suffer a -1 (cumulative) penalty to all str, dex and con checks. You must rest 24 hours for each -1 penalty in order to remove it, or have a cleric perform a healing ritual to restore you.

10-19: Nothing happens.

20: You jump up and recover 25% of your hit points. If you had suffered at least one wound during this specific crisis, the number of wounds is reduced by one. Turns out that your wounds are not as severe as they initially appeared.

 

[mhensley]

I'd coopt the death/dying rules.

When you go negative:

Each round, make a save:

1-9: you've suffered a serious wound. You suffer a -1 (cumulative) penalty to all str, dex and con checks. You must rest 24 hours for each -1 penalty in order to remove it, or have a cleric perform a healing ritual to restore you.

10-19: Nothing happens.

20: You jump up and recover 25% of your hit points. If you had suffered at least one wound during this specific crisis, the number of wounds is reduced by one. Turns out that your wounds are not as severe as they initially appeared.

Wow, I really like this. Nice and easy to use, but I would probably just say each wound gives -1 to all rolls and to their movement speed.

 

[smathis]

Wow, I really like this. Nice and easy to use, but I would probably just say each wound gives -1 to all rolls and to their movement speed.

I like this too. But I'm not sure I'd go into penalties and all that. I'd likely have the PC take a Persistent Condition. Each persistent condition would lower the PCs total Healing Surges per day by 1.

After resetting your Surges at the start of each day, roll for each persistent condition just like you would at the end of a round.

And if we're going for grit, might I suggest randomizing the recovery of Healing Surges?

Just have a PC roll their Hit Die + Con bonus at the end of a 6-hour rest. That's how many Surges they have for the day. So a Thief with 14 Con would get 1d6 + 2 Surges back. While the Fighter types would be able to recover more.

The rationale being that the PCs just spent the night sleeping in a Cave, trading watches, etc. That can hardly be considered a "good night's rest". So sometimes a Fighter would sleep uneasily and wake up with 5 Surges. Other times he'd wake up with 14.

And if you wanted to be REALLY grim with it. Have the DM keep track of Healing Surges and Hit Points in secret. I've played in games (like Unknown Armies) where the damage is described in terms of effects on the PC. It's incumbent upon the DM to communicate the relative health of a character clearly. But it's also quite awesome to hear how the battle wears on a hero (as opposed to "You take 5 points damage").

Beyond that, I'm all for a crit removing a Healing Surge as long as it has a comparable effect on the PC's opponents. Maybe giving PC's a short list of options they can take if they roll a 20 would even the odds?

 

[WhatGravitas]

Beyond that, I'm all for a crit removing a Healing Surge as long as it has a comparable effect on the PC's opponents. Maybe giving PC's a short list of options they can take if they roll a 20 would even the odds?

Well, I think 4E is already a bit player-centric, so it won't hurt that much. You can probably just give out some extra action points for the PCs.

Cheers, LT.

 

[ruleslawyer]

I wouldn't track it during the encounter. I'd save the bookkeeping for later, during the healing/recovery scene.

Anyone who was bloodied or reduced to less than 1 hp during the last encounter has to make a save. Failure means you take an injury.

Injuries do something or other. A penalty. Maybe they lower your max number of healing surges by 1.

Healing injuries takes downtime back in town or the hideout. A divine ritual or long-term care.

This one FTW, IMO.

The entire point of hp from D&D Day One is that some hit point damage *might* represent an injury. It's all about the description. If, OTOH, the divide between injury and not-injury is important for some reason, then the post-hoc mechanic seems to be the best way of resolving the issue.

So make your save, you're just beaten and bloodied scratched up like Indiana Jones or John McClane. Fail your save, and you have a nice big flesh wound that requires weeks or even months to heal.

 

[smathis]

Well, I think 4E is already a bit player-centric, so it won't hurt that much. You can probably just give out some extra action points for the PCs.

Cheers, LT.

Great point, LT. I was hoping to give out extra action points anyway.

And give the PCs more to do with them (outside of combat as well as within).

 

[SmilingPiePlate]

Why are there so many DM's willing to slap on negative effects to their players so liberally?

This doesn't make sense to me... Mostly because if i was in a game where negative 'slap on' effects were common occurrence, i wouldn't be having fun. especially, in this case, if i were the Fighter. As a Fighter it's my job to take damage instead of my friends... I would be very annoyed if i was being penalized for doing my job (ie: taking damage).

As players would you guys really be having fun in your own games?

*shrug* Everyone likes different things. Some people enjoy more lethal, dangerous games. I imagine it's the sense of danger, the feeling that every victory is earned against great odds, that fighting smart and using every edge available to you leads to more satisfying, and more believable, combats and wins, the knowledge that you're only a few steps from death.

I prefer more cinematic combat. But I can understand, or think I understand, why some people like their combat more dangerous and more unforgiving.

 

[simonbjerg]

You guys read my thoughts while I was offline. I think I would do it in slightly different way.

Each time a character receives a hit that deals more damage than the character’s fortitude defense value, then he rolls a save after his next turn (1-10: wound; 11-20 no wound). Spending an action point annuls the wound. By first assigning the wound after the players turn, the character gets a chance to use the healing surge, and thereby avoiding a “now you die” situation.

For each wound a character receives he loses one of his daily healing surges.

Wounds can only be healed after an extended rest. After six hours of uninterrupted rest the player removes one wound. A full day of rest heals two wounds. A successful heal skill check after an extended rest also heals one additional wound.

Finally I would grant the cleric an additional daily power / ritual that cures wounds. The number of wounds that the cleric can heal should be based on the cleric’s level. The cleric can assign this healing power to any number of characters (within 30 ft.?). I might also grant paladins and warlords a lesser version of the power (cure light wounds).

I’m not sure I like this better than Smartis’ system, but it would allow an in-combat distinction between “metaphysical damage” and actual wounds. If the character makes his “wound save” it’s only a flesh wound. If he fails the save it’s a big a nasty wound.

 

[SaffroN]

*shrug* Everyone likes different things. Some people enjoy more lethal, dangerous games. I imagine it's the sense of danger, the feeling that every victory is earned against great odds, that fighting smart and using every edge available to you leads to more satisfying, and more believable, combats and wins, the knowledge that you're only a few steps from death.

I prefer more cinematic combat. But I can understand, or think I understand, why some people like their combat more dangerous and more unforgiving.

Well, If you wanted to give the players a sense of danger, you would just throw stronger creatures at them.

This whole 'Trauma' business is a bit different. Its giving players negative side effects for taking significant damage. I'm sorta understanding why. Its not making the system more lethal, because if you wanted that you would just throw stronger creatures at your players. Its more about belief. Having a 6 hour rest doesn't heal the wounds that had you on the ground bleeding to death a few seconds ago.

All in all, its not a bad idea. So long as everyone is having fun with it.

If i was going to use Trauma points in my game, it would go something like:

Upon receiving a critical hit you lose a healing surge. This persists until your next uninterrupted 24hour rest, or 48hour rest, or whatever.

I wouldn't want to make it any harsher. I wouldn't want to inflict this on my players unless they asked for it. It just feels like punishing them for the sake of it. There are plenty of other ways to make the 6 hour rest more believable without slapping on negative effects.