True Strike and Invisibility question

[hong]

You still have to guess the location of the creature or you automatically miss. If you guess the location correctly then you skip the normal 50% miss chance.

I'd assume that a spell that allows you to intuit where someone is to the extent of granting a +20 insight bonus to hit would take care of such piddling details.

True strike is not a substitue for see invisibility.

Nobody ever suggested it was.

 

[Cl1mh4224rd]

I'd assume that a spell that allows you to intuit where someone is to the extent of granting a +20 insight bonus to hit would take care of such piddling details.

somehow i don't think not knowing where the target even is, is a "piddling detail"

..and for god's sake. it's a 1st level spell, even if it is only one shot per casting. at the very least, i'd think you would have to know the general area the invisible target is in. not just randomly fire an arrow and voila! it'd be too easy to locate an invisible character if all you had to do was cast a 1st level spell, then make a ranged attack...

 

[hong]

somehow i don't think not knowing where the target even is, is a "piddling detail".

What do you think negating concealment miss chances means?

 

[KarinsDad]

You still have to guess the location of the creature or you automatically miss. If you guess the location correctly then you skip the normal 50% miss chance.

True strike is not a substitue for see invisibility.

Why not?

It negates concealment, so the invisibility does not conceal. It's a divination spell (i.e. divining). And, it lasts for one round (basically).

Finally, it's magic.

What are you basing your conclusion on?

 

[skunian]

What are you basing your conclusion on?

Well I'd have to say he is basing his conclusion off of common sense. In order for you to make your missle attack you have to have some idea where your target is, once you have that idea (by making either a listen or spot check) then the spell is great. But if you walk into the center of a room and shoot randomly at the wall in front of you and the invisible guy is standing behind you, all you've done is waste an arrow.

 

[hong]

Well I'd have to say he is basing his conclusion off of common sense.

This is usually a bad idea when it comes to things that break the laws of physics....

In order for you to make your missle attack you have to have some idea where your target is, once you have that idea (by making either a listen or spot check) then the spell is great. But if you walk into the center of a room and shoot randomly at the wall in front of you and the invisible guy is standing behind you, all you've done is waste an arrow.

Why would you shoot an arrow in front of you, when the true strike spell has negated the concealment of the guy behind you?

 

[shilsen]

What do you think negating concealment miss chances means?

Archer, skunian and Cl1mh4224rd covered it to an extent, but to directly answer your question, "negating concealment miss chances" means that if you happen to aim in the right place and then score a hit (quite likely, due to the +20 bonus) on the invisible opponent, then you don't roll the 50% miss chance. But you do have to score a hit (as the PHB description of concelment states, the miss chance only comes into play when you roll well enough to hit), and if you're aiming somewhere that the target is not, you automatically can't. Simple.

 

[hong]

Archer, skunian and Cl1mh4224rd covered it to an extent, but to directly answer your question, "negating concealment miss chances" means that if you happen to aim in the right place and then score a hit (quite likely, due to the +20 bonus) on the invisible opponent, then you don't roll the 50% miss chance. But you do have to score a hit (as the PHB description of concelment states, the miss chance only comes into play when you roll well enough to hit), and if you're aiming somewhere that the target is not, you automatically can't. Simple.

I'm quite aware of how miss chances work, thanks. The point is that concealment is negated for anyone you target when true strike is active. Since they are not concealed, it seems perfectly reasonable to suppose that the "select the 5' square" requirement is also null and void.

 

[Henrix]

The point is that concealment is negated for anyone you target when true strike is active. Since they are not concealed, it seems perfectly reasonable to suppose that the "select the 5' square" requirement is also null and void.

But hong, True Strike does not take away the concealment, just the miss chance realted to it.

You still have to have a target.

Otherwise, True Strike would be an immediate Detect Enemies!
Don't know if there's an enemy somewhere in the vicinity? Just shoot a True Strike'd arrow and it'll find him!

 

[hong]

But hong, True Strike does not take away the concealment, just the miss chance realted to it.

I fail to see the difference. Perhaps it's concealed.

Otherwise, True Strike would be an immediate Detect Enemies!
Don't know if there's an enemy somewhere in the vicinity? Just shoot a True Strike'd arrow and it'll find him!

Zen archers can do funky stuff. So can blind samurai.