tumble + fly?

[hong]

The dragon in Spirited Away is a great example of tumbling in flight.

 

[borc killer]

Personally - in the situation given above, I'd let him tumble, possibly at a penalty if he agrees, THEN between games propose the "no tumbling while flying" rule.
I think that doing it the way you've done it is tremendously unfair to the players who may be banking on certain rules when they execute a plan.
The only real alternative is to rewind time when a rule is changed, and that's such a pain it's almost impossible to do properly.

Just as a point of background there is a reason why I am called Borc Killer... heheh... mostly because Borc was killed mercilessly in a few of my campaigns a long with a few others. (Yoric escaped most of my wrath... except for that meteorswarm...)

Now that had nothing to do with his ruling but if I, in the past, had used Saeviomagy point above I think I would have quite a few less notches on my DMing belt. I enforced rules as I saw them and then did not let the PC change what they had done (who thought they worked differently before they got in to an uber bad spot, just as I thought he would let me tumble while flying). So I think if anything he and I have learned that we should be more lenient at the table and then hash it out later.

I really do think you guys for helping us out with this! Even if it did not answer the question definitively.

Borc Killer

 

[Numion]

My first rule of DMing these days is this:

When in doubt, say "yes."

In other words, if a player asks you if an ability would work, and you're not sure, say that it'll work. Only nix an idea if it would be completely unbalancing and/or create a boring, always-effective tactic.

A good rule. And one of the most important as DMs. It's a shame it took so long for me to get it

I have the whole damn game to control as a DM - players 'own' only the character. Let em make the most out of it!

 

[Pielorinho]

A good rule. And one of the most important as DMs. It's a shame it took so long for me to get it

Heck, ask my players -- I'm still trying to get it.

Daniel

 

[Hypersmurf]

I believe, for example, that you may tumble as part of a the straight movement of a charge: certainly nothing in the rules explicitly forbids this.

Although given that the move part of a charge carries certain restrictions that you don't have when you move otherwise, I'd say that the move part of a charge does not qualify as "normal movement"...

-Hyp.

 

[MerakSpielman]

See, that's where I see the problem, there's no concrete definition for what movement is normal and what is abnormal. It's all a judgement call.

I mean, what kinds of movement are there? Walking, double moving, running, swimming, climbing, charging, burrowing, flying, jumping, falling, teleporting... I know I've missed some.

Without thinking about the "tumble" question, can you just pick and choose which ones are considered "normal?" Does it depend on what kind of critter you are?

 

[Pielorinho]

There IS no definition of "normal" movement; I therefore ignore the word "normal" as irrelevant to the rules, rather than trying to read a definition into a place where none exists.

Daniel

 

[noretoc]

"I tumble down between them" I close my eyes and picture a person who is in midair, twisting and turning his body to face down and taking off, while air elementals are flinging wind at him. That sounds cool. That is why I would allow it. I want to encourage my players to use thier heads and think out side of the "number and rolling" game. I would never shut down a player who was thinking that way with a no. Maybe a penalty, but never a "You cant use that".

 

[DarkMaster]

I don't know why you say that it outmaneuver if you play with a grid like I do, you will see that it doesn't. True while the PC or NPC is tumbling he is probably making a 360 turn but this turn is not "controlled". The PC cannot decide in the middle of its tumble (180 degree) that he can come back, he cannot since then it would outmaneuver it flying class.

When the PC is on the ground same thing happens the rule state that it's base speed is walking, running, well while he is tumbling he is not really walking, he might be rolling on it back or walking on his hand or whathever. the rule doesn't state exactly what he is doing but it states that it must do all that within its natural movement ability.

I don't see any problem to have the thief in my group(my wife) tumble while she is flying to pass through an air elemental threath zone has long as grid wise she stays within her maneovrability and movement scale (flying).

In any case I must admit that I like heroic moves it makes everybody in my group enjoy the game and their character much more. Learn to know the character in your group and adjust your encounter accordingly, but don't do metagaming players just hate it