D&D (2024) Uncommon items - actually common?

[Vaalingrade]

I'm not sure it really adds to verisimilitude. I mean, "There's magic!" "OK, where's it come from?" "The Weave." "OK, where's that come from?" "It's Weave all the way down!"

Doesn't add to anything good either.

Which is weird because this choice was made by the company that brought us tapping the power of your homeland or an innate, rare spark of creation buried within your soul to power spells. But nope, Proper Noun is all we get. We don't even get concepts of how 'the weave' is implemented like in Wheel of Time.

 

[Maxperson]

There's a bit of a tradition, though, of D&D rulebooks saying how magic use fits into the cosmology of the game. Gygax had a description of this in his DMG, with magical energy coming from "some other plane of the multiverse", typically the positive or negative material plane.

I'm not sure it really adds to verisimilitude. I mean, "There's magic!" "OK, where's it come from?" "The Weave." "OK, where's that come from?" "It's Weave all the way down!"

In the Forgotten Realms it comes from Mystra. In Eberron it comes from wherever was mentioned upthread that tells you. The origins of the "Weave" are there.

 

[Maxperson]

I'm not saying it exist for reusing spells.

I am saying that WOTC barely mentioned the Weave alternatives and the shared multiverse until after they publicly ditched the mystic and Dark Sun as 5e official products where psionics would have its own "magic" system.

Suddenly the First World and every setting having similar fundamental concepts became common official talking points

Okay. I see what you are saying.

My feeling is that the Weave has nothing to do with that. It appears that they are trying to create a situation where all of their settings are connected and the Multiverse is a natural conduit to that goal. The Weave, if it's taking greater prominence, is just a natural byproduct of that goal of connecting the settings.

 

[Maxperson]

Trouble is that "multiverse stuff" tends to be much closer to "almost always literal FR loredump being presented as something setting agnostic". Unfortunately that leads to some fans of that setting to dig in with certainty of it being purely generic fluff even while using it to draw upon more FR lore

That I think, is a byproduct of their general allergy to uniqueness. They make pretty much all settings generic, kitchen sink settings, which was one of the purposes the Forgotten Realms in 2e. Most 2e settings were unique. You played the Realms or Greyhawk if you wanted kitchen sink. The similarity between the Realms and everything else is more a coincidence generated by generic kitchen sink than some sort of "Let's make it all like the Realms" ideology.

 

[Minigiant]

My feeling is that the Weave has nothing to do with that. It appears that they are trying to create a situation where all of their settings are connected and the Multiverse is a natural conduit to that goal. The Weave, if it's taking greater prominence, is just a natural byproduct of that goal of connecting the settings.

it's more a byproduct of...

their general allergy to uniqueness. They make pretty much all settings generic, kitchen sink settings, which was one of the purposes the Forgotten Realms in 2e.

They want all their settings to work like FR and GH so they can produce the least amount of content and maximize profits.

A Multiverse where every setting with magic has their own version of the Weave, Inner Plane, Outer Planes, and deities being a subset of of a large set of outer plane divines allowed in each setting.

 

[Jfdlsjfd]

I concur with the similarity between settings being certainly a goal. It's especially true of races: they all had to fit in any settings so we started to see goliath everywhere. If they are in the rules, I can see why some players would want to use them and be unhappy if their character concept doesn't fit the settings... "sorry, you can't be a Pact of the Blade warlock, because in this settings, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords are only the basis of a system of government, not magical powers."

The Weave is however something describe in a very odd way. They tell us :

1. Casters do not interact directly with magic
2. They interact it by manipulating "The Weave"
3. The Weave is something that is non-descript and setting dependant and change names and natures accordingly

So, why isn't the Weave directly magic? How this level of interface added to magic add to anything? It's not like there was a Weave in the real world to relate to, it's not like characters in settings can be totally wrong about how magic work (and yet have some parts that work so spells function but for totally different reason) and I don't think it provides some useful worldbuilding for players to interact with, since it's just equivalent to interacting with magic directly.

 

[Minigiant]

So, why isn't the Weave directly magic? How this level of interface added to magic add to anything? It's not like there was a Weave in the real world to relate to, it's not like characters in settings can be totally wrong about how magic work (and yet have some parts that work so spells function but for totally different reason) and I don't think it provides some useful worldbuilding for players to interact with, since it's just equivalent to interacting with magic directly.

The Weave more or less explains why D&D magic is in preplanned chunks of effects that come out as rigid spells and structure magic items.

D&D isn't a game where you can vomit you innate magic out your mouth onto your foes or push a magic blast out a stick. You cast rigid spells and activate engineered items. Because whether isn't the Weave, the Aether, the Fade, the Force, or the Way there is something between you an the magic structuring it.

And rich NPC can buy into that structure.

 

[pemerton]

So, why isn't the Weave directly magic? How this level of interface added to magic add to anything? It's not like there was a Weave in the real world to relate to, it's not like characters in settings can be totally wrong about how magic work (and yet have some parts that work so spells function but for totally different reason) and I don't think it provides some useful worldbuilding for players to interact with, since it's just equivalent to interacting with magic directly.

Agreed.

The Weave more or less explains why D&D magic is in preplanned chunks of effects that come out as rigid spells and structure magic items.

That can be the rote structure of spells (ie lean into the Vancian-ness of it). It doesn't need a "Weave" to explain it. And I don't even see how the Weave is meant to explain it - couldn't a skilled practitioner play or pluck the Weave as they wish?

 

[Minigiant]

That can be the rote structure of spells (ie lean into the Vancian-ness of it). It doesn't need a "Weave" to explain it. And I don't even see how the Weave is meant to explain it - couldn't a skilled practitioner play or pluck the Weave as they wish?

Because they are still casting rigid spells in the Weave.

None of the D&D classes can pluck the Weave and get an effect. You always get a rigid Vancian spell.

No Zatanna, Dr. Strange, Scarlet Witch, or Raven and creating a new magical effect on the spot.