Underpowered Guns in d20 Modern (rant, long)

[ragboy]

The M2HB is a lot more powerful in real life, putting out way more bullets, etc etc. The knight would die. Then again, if you make weapons overpowered, PCs and NPCs gravitate towards such weapons. The game would no longer be about characters, but who has the biggest weapons.

That probably depends on your campaign world, more than anything. If you're seeing .50's (or any guns, really) lighting up bad guys on the street, then it's either a wartime game or you're definitely playing at a high cinematic level. (By 'your,' I don't necessarily mean you Psi). If you're not and the characters still want to get heavy ordnance, then a few terms in prison tends to cool them off some.

 

[Pagan priest]

True, but in the context of the game, a hit may mean a bullet dead center of the torso, or it may mean a grazing blow that barely bleeds. That is the whole point of the hit point system... that luck factor that is the difference between a gaping hole where your heart and lungs used to be, or two holes in your shirt and a scratch along a rib.

 

[Dalamar]

Ignore the end of the post. Here I was making a brilliant answer to hove the mount couldn't cross that dretch easily, and after posting, I notice that the knight was unmounted. Oh well, not going to remove all that nice analyzation just for that, maybe somebody will get good laughs off my stupidness from it.
I did, however, notice one interesting thing. In d20 Modern, heavy armor does not decrease one's running speed to x3 according to the SRD (and 55ft would still be just within the character's running distance in DnD too).

((What's the average weight of a human male in d20 Modern? I'm working off the SRD, and with a quick look-through, I couldn't find that information. However, the weight that the horse is carrying is 75lbs from the equipment that the character has, plus some lbs for a saddle, plus the weight of the character. And the horse's light load limit is 150lbs.
So unless the knight is really thin (weighting in at only around 70lbs), the horse has a -8 (+1 Str, -6 speed 20ft, -3 Medium load) Jump modifier (and when jumping with a mount, you use the rider's Ride or the mount's Jump, whichever is less), so making that Jump check to cross the drench isn't such an easy thing after all unless the drench less than 5ft in width. For a 5ft drench, the mount actually needs to jump 10ft to get its whole area over the drench (otherwise its rear would end up in the drench), needing to roll an 18 on the Jump check. So the soldier likely has several rounds before the knight gets over that drench.))

 

[Caliber]

It is a rule in T20.

Its also a rule in Gamma World d20, which uses d20 Modern as its core mechanics.

 

[Sebastian Ashputtle]

A perfect summary of what's wrong with playing modern-type games in the d20 system.

This is why I use D&D for all my fantasy gaming, and GURPS for anything modern.

 

[Emiricol]

That would be one viewpoint, yes.

 

[RPGRealms]

Its also a rule in Gamma World d20, which uses d20 Modern as its core mechanics.

Its a -2 AC modifier for archaic armor and a +2 AC modifier for advanced armor against firearms and bows in Gamma World.

 

[Krieg]

When you're talking about a .50, where you hit them is immaterial. Unless it's a digit. You hit them in the arm, their torso's shredded. Their leg; they have no legs.

A bit off-topic perhaps, but...

In a word...Bull.

November 1990, NW of Al-Jubayl Saudi Arabia at Camp (Hall whatever) 15. About 100 yards inside the main gate was an emplacement with a Browning M2. The Marine manning the position was bored & tapping his thumbs on the butterful trigger while humming to himself. He negligently fires two rounds from the weapon. At the gate is a M-1009 CUCV with two Navy Seabeas waiting to gain entrance to the camp. The first round entered the vehicle through the radiator, passing through the valve cover at the top of the engine & through the dash. It then struck one of the Seabeas in the left shoulder, passing through his clavicle just inside the shoulder joint before exiting through the rear of the vehicle.

The Seabea lived. His torso was not "shredded". He did not lose his arm. He eventually regained 90% of his original range of motion in his arm.

I was the duty driver for the guard shift. The duty NCO, A-duty & myself reached the scene within 5 minutes of the incident. I personally helped load the Seabea into the medavac.

Under most circumstances a .50 round punches a half inch (not "fist sized") hole completely through a human target.

I speak from personal experience.

Of course in a real world scenario the Knight in question would never reach the gunner alive, but that is the difference between an RPG and real life.

(Sorry but sometimes the exagerations touch a nerve.)

 

[Sebastian Ashputtle]

Isn't it neat how every second poster on enworld is ex-military? There are probably more ex-military enworld members than there are current members of the entire US Armed Forces!

By the way, did I mention I'm a former Navy SEAL? That was after my stint in the Israeli army, of course.

 

[blaskowicz]

A perfect summary of what's wrong with playing modern-type games in the d20 system.

This is why I use D&D for all my fantasy gaming, and GURPS for anything modern.

That's an alternative we are considering also. The problem is we'd have to scrap everything we already did for d20, which we put a lot of work into. Also, we got a lot of players here too lazy to learn GURPS rules....
But I am also a strong "D&D for fantasy/GURPS for modern supporter". When we get our hands on the new 4th edition (of GURPS) we are going to re-evaluate our decision, also based on what we saw of d20 Future.