Unearthed Arcana Unearthed Arcana: Wizards & Warlocks -- Hexblades, Raven Queens, and Lore Mastery!

Master of Hexes Starting at 14th level, you can use your Hexblade’s Curse again without resting, but when you apply it to a new target, the curse immediately ends on the previous target. Does this mean you can cast it one more time, or over and over again? And does the 1 minute duration reset upon a new target, or does it continue from the previous target?

Master of Hexes
Starting at 14th level, you can use your
Hexblade’s Curse again without resting, but
when you apply it to a new target, the curse
immediately ends on the previous target.


Does this mean you can cast it one more time, or over and over again? And does the 1 minute duration reset upon a new target, or does it continue from the previous target?
 

Parmandur

Book-Friend
Whereas I want nothing to do with a game like DnD that puts all of those into subclasses. Subclasses aren't even a a fraction as big as I would need them to be for that.

Also for me fighter will never be a good fit for ranger, even a little bit. I can at least see the logic of a rogue subclass, but not at all fighter.

Heck, I'd rather have no fighter or wizard class, and have the concepts we tend to put in them as their own classes, than the other way around.

what I mean by game like DnD is, a game based on distinct abilities that a given character has limited access to.
Yeah, that's why they don't have just four classes, like early play test versions.

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cbwjm

Seb-wejem
Whereas I want nothing to do with a game like DnD that puts all of those into subclasses. Subclasses aren't even a a fraction as big as I would need them to be for that.

Also for me fighter will never be a good fit for ranger, even a little bit. I can at least see the logic of a rogue subclass, but not at all fighter.

Heck, I'd rather have no fighter or wizard class, and have the concepts we tend to put in them as their own classes, than the other way around.

what I mean by game like DnD is, a game based on distinct abilities that a given character has limited access to.

I'm not saying we should get rid of those classes either, my original comment was literally all of the backgrounds listed by Moonsong could easily be done with the wizard class instead of a sorcerer, all it really needs is a change to the fluff of the class and some minor mechanical changes. You could even get away with no mechanical changes if you just ignore the spellbook section of the wizard and just run off what spells you have prepared as your spell list. In so doing I could make a wizard that actively wants to get rid of his magic. That didn't chose to have magic. That isn't a bookworm. That isn't actively seeking for more magic. That has an irrational and emotional approach to magic.
 

Tales and Chronicles

Jewel of the North, formerly know as vincegetorix
This. Even if the warlock is my favorite class ever, I dont understand why ''how you get your powers'' have such a big impact on arcane spellcasters. I mean, we dont have different martial classes because I bought my sword instead of having it being gifted to me, or because I use it left-handed.
And bard, if changed to chanter (I, for one, am thrilled by the Pillars of Eternity PnP), could be a druid subclass based of floklore/ancient spirits inhabiting songs and tales of different people. Druid are more than just tree-huger, animal summoner hermits.
 

ppaladin123

Adventurer
I think the hexblade could just be handled with an invocation: requirement (pact of blade): you gain proficiency with medium armor and shields. Would require a 3 level dip at least so it is not easily exploitable by multiclass.

Of course errata to give this to the pact of blade upon taking the pact (same with valor bard) would work too but WotC is very skittish about errata these days (I think they overcorrected for 4e excesses).
 

MoonSong

Rules-lawyering drama queen but not a munchkin
This. Even if the warlock is my favorite class ever, I dont understand why ''how you get your powers'' have such a big impact on arcane spellcasters. I mean, we dont have different martial classes because I bought my sword instead of having it being gifted to me, or because I use it left-handed.

It has historic reasons. When they created the game, they wanted to make a generic spellcaster , that is the source of "magic-user", they wanted it to stand for all possible casters. The problem is, the creators of the game had a quite specific archetype in mind when they designed it. Thus the book, the emphasis on smarts, the hunt of magic as a reason to adventure. And those elements were core to the class. Yet designers treated this quite specific thing as if it was truly generic. And it showed.

Want to be a witch? spellbook, Want to play Circe the demigodess? spellbook, want to play Samantha or Jenny? spellbook, Gandalf? spellbook. A fairy? spellbook.


It was a square hole where we were expected to force pegs of all shapes into.

A few decades later the designers accidentally "found" the sorcerer when looking for an alternative to vancian casting. An I mean accidentally found, because the sorcerer was a vehicle for different mechanics. Yet, the different origin rang a bell, Jenny, Samantha, Circe, Sabrina, Fairies, Nymphs all of them fit better under that version of the sorcerer than under any other version of the wizard -ok, Sabrina fits under the 5e wizard-. Later another story with other mechanics was created and the warlock was born, fully cementing distinct origin/distinct class and mechanics.

If the magic user had been truly generic we wouldn't be having this discussion. But the wizard wouldn't be as iconic as it is. As long as the wizard remains as iconic and with that specific story, we will need alternatives for the other possible origins and approaches to magic. Or not, but that is the quickest way to tell a group of players you don't want them at the same table.
 

doctorbadwolf

Heretic of The Seventh Circle
I'm not saying we should get rid of those classes either, my original comment was literally all of the backgrounds listed by Moonsong could easily be done with the wizard class instead of a sorcerer, all it really needs is a change to the fluff of the class and some minor mechanical changes. You could even get away with no mechanical changes if you just ignore the spellbook section of the wizard and just run off what spells you have prepared as your spell list. In so doing I could make a wizard that actively wants to get rid of his magic. That didn't chose to have magic. That isn't a bookworm. That isn't actively seeking for more magic. That has an irrational and emotional approach to magic.

Sure, you could reflavor a wizard that way, but I think the point is that you can't make a wizard into a sorcerer without repurposing things, and that even then it will feel (at least for may people) like a repurposed kludge, and that is enough of a justification to have the sorcerer around.

The idea is that "complete refluff and some mechanical changes" is too much to genuinely say, "you can make these backgrounds using the wizard.

I mean, I could build a monk with the wizard with some reflavorin and a few mechanical changes, but I don't think it is a stretch to say I can't make a character with a monk's background/concept using the wizard. Becaus doing so requires houseruling the wizard.

Although, that said, I played a wizard-as-monk in 4e, and it was The Best.
 

doctorbadwolf

Heretic of The Seventh Circle
Yeah, that's why they don't have just four classes, like early play test versions.

To be fair, that kind of design can work really well. See: Star Wars Saga Edition. But that is also a game that needed a damn character builder. Not because the math was complicated, but because there were so many distinct options to go through to mke a character. But the system works very well, and models an enormous array of character archetypes.

But in a game with subclasses that are as small as 5e DnD? Not a chance.
 


MoonSong

Rules-lawyering drama queen but not a munchkin
I'm not saying we should get rid of those classes either, my original comment was literally all of the backgrounds listed by Moonsong could easily be done with the wizard class instead of a sorcerer, all it really needs is a change to the fluff of the class and some minor mechanical changes. You could even get away with no mechanical changes if you just ignore the spellbook section of the wizard and just run off what spells you have prepared as your spell list. In so doing I could make a wizard that actively wants to get rid of his magic. That didn't chose to have magic. That isn't a bookworm. That isn't actively seeking for more magic. That has an irrational and emotional approach to magic.

rule 0 fallacy?
 


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