Unintended(?) Consequence of No More X-Mas Tree?

[Njall]

After meeting Old Man Willow, the hobbits rest at Tom Bombadil's. Since hit points mean more than wounds, it is quite possible that they were recovering there despite not being "blooded". After Moria, the entire Company rests in Lothlorian. They mention being weary, and both Sam and Frodo are injured. Aragorn & company cannot immediately ride to Mordor after the Battle of Pelanor Fields, and when they do ride, they cannot bring every knight with them due to injuries. Faramir, Eowyn, and Merry all end up in the Houses of Healing.

RC

Yeah, but sometimes they're physically wounded, more often, they're not.
Do I need to say that real people need to rest from time to time, and D&D doesn't have any rules to handle fatigue?
Sure, in books ( and in movies, as well...) people need healing ( aside from rest...you generally don't heal from a serious wound just resting...) when wounded.
In D&D you need to rest for a couple of days just from parrying a blow.

 

[Raven Crowking]

Not sure I agree with this, either. There is nothing unbalanced or wrongbadfun about making gaining levels harder the higher level you are. As you get closer to the pinnacle of achievement, it is harder to surpass where you are. This is not unlike increasing velocity -- the faster you are going, the harder it is to go even faster.

0xp =/= growing slowly.
0xp = not growing at all.

For that opponent.

And, if you can find a way to take on truly difficult opponents, then you can grow.

But, in this case, having a single houserule that also effectively caps levels before they get too far into the absurdly superhuman is a feature, not a bug. It makes the low-magic world far more credible, while making it far easier to make the uber-tough guys uber-tough in relation to the world. I will also note that, under such a system, reaching 20th level will take years of play, and it will mean something when you make it there.

Yes. After every combat.
For the average fighter, AC caps at around 23, with a tower shield.
This means that hitting him is a trivial task for just about anything in the MM, after CR 5.

Which means that any creature from CR 5 + is a heck of lot less common, and a heck of a lot more of a threat. So?

Some monsters can be virtually "one shotted" everytime you meet one. They don't pose any credible threat.

Use more. If the PCs can make X attacks each round, then X+Y is a credible threat, so long as the monsters can hit the PCs, and so long as any damage they do cannot be immediately negated.

Easy. Really, really easy.

If you're going to stick to semanthics, I'll do the same: it's in a rulebook, nowhere in the book it says it's more optional than anything else in the book, then it's a rule.

You might want to check that rulebook more closely, my friend.


RC

 

[Raven Crowking]

In D&D you need to rest for a couple of days just from parrying a blow.

That's a misconception.

In D&D, you sometimes are not at your best due to long-term fatigue, and need to rest a bit to be at your best. However, you never need to rest for a couple of days just from parrying a blow. Indeed, unless you are dropped, you never need to rest from hit point loss at all.

And, BTW, this is a pretty good mechanic for creating behaviour akin to that of the hobbits after encountering Old Man Willow. If you pull out stories by Robert E. Howard or Edgar Rice Burroughs, you will find even more examples.

RC

 

[Njall]

The problem is that 3rd Edition started with the numbers of 2nd Edition and just tried to patch the problems. It still had a lot of the problems caused by those 2nd Ed numbers.

I agree... and I think the same is true for magic items.
They imported most of the iconic magic items, so we had tons of AC boosting items and very few giving to hit bonuses. Furthermore, in 2e the stacking rules were far more restrictive.
Had these been balanced in the first place, we'd probably have a system that's more similar to d20 modern or Conan, as far as class progression goes, with level having a better impact on a character's defenses.

 

[ThirdWizard]

Yes, because "You rest up for three days, and are now at full hit points" takes so long to say that there's really no point in playing any more that day.

You don't play out bed rest minute by minute? What are you, some kinda roll-playing munchkin? I make my players detail every bedpan change and uncomfortable gas expellation! That's real roleplaying!

 

[Raven Crowking]

You don't play out bed rest minute by minute? What are you, some kinda roll-playing munchkin? I make my players detail every bedpan change and uncomfortable gas expellation! That's real roleplaying!

I love you, too, ThirdWizard.

 

[Njall]

That's a misconception.

In D&D, you sometimes are not at your best due to long-term fatigue, and need to rest a bit to be at your best. However, you never need to rest for a couple of days just from parrying a blow. Indeed, unless you are dropped, you never need to rest from hit point loss at all.

Well, not IME.
The average hit from a CR 9 opponent ( Ice Giant ) deals 23 damage. An Ice Giant will hit a 20th level fighter without magic items ( AC 23 on average, with a tower shield, as I said earlier ) 80% of the time. This means that a 20th level fighter will need 1 day for being in combat with an Ice Giant for 2 rounds.
Since a blow from a giant axe would pretty much kill any man outright, I have to assume that HP ( as the rulebooks say, it's not like I'm making anything up in this regard ) he's turned the blow in a near-hit.
Two of said "near-hits" and he'll need a day in bed to fully recover his HP.

And, BTW, this is a pretty good mechanic for creating behaviour akin to that of the hobbits after encountering Old Man Willow. If you pull out stories by Robert E. Howard or Edgar Rice Burroughs, you will find even more examples.

RC

Eh, I don't remember Conan needing to rest after every fight
He just...well, parried his opponent's blows. And parried blows, in the real world, hardly deal enough damage that you need to rest a couple of days just to recover.

 

[Njall]

Yes, because "You rest up for three days, and are now at full hit points" takes so long to say that there's really no point in playing any more that day.




RC

Missed this one
Not so easy if:
1) Your party is not in town and
2) Your teammates are not, in fact, forced to rest and want to do something else while you're just stuck recovering your lost HP.

 

[Raven Crowking]

Well, not IME.
The average hit from a CR 9 opponent ( Ice Giant ) deals 23 damage. An Ice Giant will hit a 20th level fighter without magic items ( AC 23 on average, with a tower shield, as I said earlier ) 80% of the time. This means that a 20th level fighter will need 1 day from being in combat with an Ice Giant for 1 round.
Since a blow from a giant axe would pretty much kill any man outright, I have to assume that HP ( as the rulebooks say, it's not like I'm making anything up in this regard ) he's turned the blow in a near-hit.
Two of said "near-hits" and he'll need a day in bed to fully recover his HP.

Well, I don't assume that characters automatically need to fully recover hit points, which is where we differ.

Conan, when tired, tends to plow on until dropped. He recovers whenever he gets the chance (and spends more days carousing than he would need to with strict bed rest).

RC

 

[LostSoul]

I maintain that this statement is untrue.

It is easy to run low magic at high levels in 3.X with a one simple houserule: Spellcasters gain normal level benefits at every second level. Thus, a houseruled 4th level wizard is equivalent to a 2nd level wizard. Don't like it? Don't play a spellcaster. After all, reducing the number of spellcasters is one of the necessary things to create a lower-magic game.

What do you do about Fly + Protection from Arrows? and Fly + Improved Invisibility?