Unsatisfactory BBEG Fight?

[tylerthehobo]

Ohhhhh, been there done that. That's what BBEG henchmen are for.

That and changing his stats on the fly. I've built mods where the BBEG made sense at EL 15 at the start, but the characters picked up a level and munchkined to where EL 18 would be more appropriate. No harm changing the NPC on the fly if the rewards are likewise updated.

 

[AuraSeer]

This just happened to us a week ago. In RttToEE, we finally got the drop on Hedrack, who had been harrassing and taunting us since sometime in 2004 (real time!). He got utterly crushed before he ever had a chance to act. We're absolutely satisfied. In fact, I think some of us stood up and danced.

I'm so satisfied, I can't stop telling the story.
In the surprise round, my warlock nailed him with a critical disintegrate, from a scroll I'd bought months ago just for him. Apparently 150 points wasn't enough to drop him immediately, but as soon as the rest of the party got to melee range, he got killed very thoroughly indeed.

 

[Agent Oracle]

As a Player, I'd be shocked. and then thrilled. Of course, you NEVER go into the BBEG's room at anything less than peak condition, so i could see it happening.

as a DM... I'd be shocked... then pull out my emergency Plan B. And declare. "As you watch in horror, the Big Bad's body recuperates instantly. He reaches to his hand and pulls off a blackened ring. 'So much for the cataclysm avoidance enchantment.' he says, tossing it aside. (just for safety's sake, i write it as a magic object on every BB's sheet)

Seriously, every time my players fight a BBEG, I split the party's focus across multiple objectives.

1. The BBEG is not alone, he has a lieutenant there with him, and possibly some mooks as well. These act as a buffer between the party and the Big Bad, and force the players to fight more strategically (if the archer takes shots at the BBEG, he's probably going to get swarmed by the mooks. Same thing is the wizard goes out with disintegrate, or if the barbarian just charges, he'll be drawing lots of AoO's)

2. There is a hostage / McGuffin in the room that needs to be preserved / collected / stopped from blowing up the planet etc. This is especially great if the BBEG wants to get away

 

[Shemeska]

I would feel utterly and completely ripped off if that was the end of the campaign. All that struggle and then it's over with a whimper rather than bang? Hell no.

That's the point where the DM needs to honestly consider fudging something to keep the BBEG alive long enough to make sure than the PCs feel the accomplishment of a hard fought and hard won struggle. They'll feel like they earned it, rather than just it being a goof up on the BBEG's part.

LBEG's and MBEG's can have botched roles or goofs that result in them being slaughtered and you can laugh about it in perpetuity, but if you've had a serious campaign and there's emotional weight behind the players desire to really kick a BBEG's tail, then have the decency to make it a hard fight and not let dice get in the way of that if something bizarre rears its ugly head on the first round of the fight.

 

[Numion]

As a player I think it would be excellent. If I had the PC scoring the lucky hit I would be extatic.

Stepping in my characters shoes I would most probably think that there are always more fights to be fought and getting one lucky wouldn't be too bad. The BBEG or his minions had already killed a few of my friends, mind you.

As a DM I would be wary of pulling a stunt such as some of you have suggested. If there was an obvious trick to cheat life (like a phylactery the PCs neglected to look for, or didn't dispose the of body, etc..) I might use it, but nothing too contrived. I know that someone can be resurrected without a body, but if someone had those kind of guns (like True Res), wouldn't this be adventure material for a higher level group?

In a perfect world every BBEG would pay a 100,000 gp retainer to a 17th level cleric to True Resurrect him on the 1st of every month unless he report to the cleric via a sending. But would that make for a more satisfying game?

I'd never ever fudge the BBEG back to life on the spot because the PCs were lucky. It would defeat the PCs purpose of doing everything in their power to defeat their hated enemy. I mean, they could be good, but not too good or the DM pushes the reset button on the match.

 

[Numion]

They'll feel like they earned it, rather than just it being a goof up on the BBEG's part.

You got it wrong, it's not a goof on the BBEGs part. He's got half the spells in the PHB as buffs, he's got all his resources stocked, he's ready to roll. His only border conditions are:

1) He must be about party level +5-8 EL, because else he's going to be in another adventure

2) He actually has to, at some point, actually confront the PCs. In this example it took 10 levels or so, and required substantial hardship on the PCs part. (If he doesn't, that's gotta be unsatisfactory).

The quick victory was not due the BBEGs lack of preparation, but due to the PCs luck. Say, a player rolls a better init, rolls only nat 20s on his dispel rolls for the important spells, then crits on a disintegrate, BBEG rolls '1' on the save. Or some such freak luck.

 

[kolikeos]

I would feel satisfied and there would be much laughing around the table and congratulations to the player whose PC got the lucky shot off.

the same thing happend when a big n tough monster failed the save against my slay living on round one.

 

[Nightchilde-2]

I know when it happened to me, it was a little satisfying and a little unsatisfying all at the same time.

The scenario:

At 3rd level, the party released a very powerful, ancient lich and her bound balor bodyguard. Seeing them not as a threat, she spanked them all soundly but left them alive.

After a little over a year of gameplay, the party was 18th level, the lich was 25th level. The PCs had been getting involved in the lich's plots off and on (mostly on) this entire time. She was just about to activate her ultimate plan to unleash a trapped, angry extraplanar god into Waterdeep in her plot to totally undermine the financial power of humans when...

Our arcane archer won initiative and shot her with an arrow of undead slaying and I rolled a "1" on the save.

So, unsatisfying for how it turned out, but also satisfying because I knew the players (especially the one that fired the arrow) felt proud of their accomplishments, and they still talk about that campaign to this day.

 

[Gold Roger]

I know when it happened to me, it was a little satisfying and a little unsatisfying all at the same time.

The scenario:

At 3rd level, the party released a very powerful, ancient lich and her bound balor bodyguard. Seeing them not as a threat, she spanked them all soundly but left them alive.

After a little over a year of gameplay, the party was 18th level, the lich was 25th level. The PCs had been getting involved in the lich's plots off and on (mostly on) this entire time. She was just about to activate her ultimate plan to unleash a trapped, angry extraplanar god into Waterdeep in her plot to totally undermine the financial power of humans when...

Our arcane archer won initiative and shot her with an arrow of undead slaying and I rolled a "1" on the save.

So, unsatisfying for how it turned out, but also satisfying because I knew the players (especially the one that fired the arrow) felt proud of their accomplishments, and they still talk about that campaign to this day.

Um, undead are only affected by fort save effects that affect objects...

 

[Numion]

Um, undead are only affected by fort save effects that affect objects...

I would think an arrow of undead slaying falls outside that rule