Vampire: The Requiem blurb in Previews

[Mercule]

Is it even possible to promote a game on it's own merits without resorting to passive aggressive swipes?

I'm not sure it's meant as a swipe rather than a distinction between games. My understanding is that many of the WWGS guys play quite a bit of D&D. Ethan and Ari having a presence on these boards points in that direction, at the least.

Not to mention Ethan's always been polite, even when I flamed Werewolf. I find it difficult to believe that behavior like that is related to a swipe at D&D.

Of course, there's always the possibility of a cynical copywriter, I imagine. I still wouldn't turn it into a corporate stance.

 

[Aaron2]

Is it even possible to promote a game on it's own merits without resorting to passive aggressive swipes?

What's funny to me is that WW produces more D&D products than anyone else.


Aaron

 

[Guldor]

Hi im new to this board, and i registered cause this topic is very interisting to me. One thing: Im from Germany so please excuse my english
Ok now to WoD. I think is the game with the best background ever written. Im a bit interested in history and there are so many names, happenings and other things in WoD, which are related to the real history: Its amazing. Ok sometimes its difficult so build in your own plot, but withsome work ist possible and you dont have all the source books.
So I am a bit afraid of the new edition. The whole storyline from its beginnigs with caine and the antideluvinas to gehenna is some piece of fine art..... and then at the end there suddenly is a complete new world? To me it sounds a bit inconsequent.... Is it right that the new edition takes place after gehenna?

Greetings Guldor

 

[Barastrondo]

I'm not sure it's meant as a swipe rather than a distinction between games. My understanding is that many of the WWGS guys play quite a bit of D&D. Ethan and Ari having a presence on these boards points in that direction, at the least.

It's funny. I ran what I thought was going to be a one-shot of D&D when I first started working at White Wolf way back in, what, 1995? '96? And they never really let me stop doing it. I might have abandoned my homebrew a long time ago (on account of embarrassing holdovers from its college years) if it weren't for people like my wife who love it so much.

Of course, there's always the possibility of a cynical copywriter, I imagine. I still wouldn't turn it into a corporate stance.

It isn't a corporate stance. We don't feel a yawning internal void of self-loathing for partnering with Necromancer and Malhavoc, and we don't flagellate ourselves for the Sword and Sorcery imprint.

That said, my favorite D&D games are always the ones that are about mood and theme more than weapons and equipment — which is true of most any game. Sometimes weapons are a key part of the mood and theme, mind (try doing an Arabian game without scimitars, or a Nordic game without spears and axes) — but I save the equipment treadmill style of play for video games.

I would also note that the cited bit of marketing text doesn't say a thing about "there is no combat in the World of Darkness." There's conflict in the setting aplenty, and a given amount will always be resolved via bloodshed; hell, how could you do a game about werewolves where people being torn to bits is a rare thing? It talks about theme, mood and plot over equipment and weapons — and whether you think that's snarky or not, it's an important point to convey. How seriously can you take a setting where werewolves fight with guns and katanas more often than they use claws and fangs? The emphasis has to be elsewhere if you want to really get across playing a supernatural being.

So I am a bit afraid of the new edition. The whole storyline from its beginnigs with caine and the antideluvinas to gehenna is some piece of fine art..... and then at the end there suddenly is a complete new world? To me it sounds a bit inconsequent.... Is it right that the new edition takes place after gehenna?

No, it isn't. The new World of Darkness is a separate, if slightly parallel, world to the original. Gehenna never happened in the new World of Darkness — in fact, there may never have been legends of Gehenna at all. Some familiar setting elements will be present, if much-changed — really, they'll just be analogues of the original WoD's setting elements, rather than the same ones with a new coat of paint. Other elements will be very conspicuous by their absence.

One of the core things we wanted to do with the new books was to capture that feeling that the first adopters of Vampire got way back in '91 — that feeling of excitement and mystery, of picking up these books where you recognized some aspects of vampires but discovered there was so much more to explore and play with. A post-Gehenna/Apocalypse/Ascension setting would be too familiar. We wanted something fresh.

 

[Guldor]

Thank you for your answer! In that case I think its a nice new idea! But see, i like the old storyline very much. And so , for me, it would be a dump thing to simply reproduce the whole thing with a few other names and rules. But if it is build up completely new, you have got my permission
Another thing. Will you leave the storysteller system?

Greetings form Germany and a happy Vampire Fan

 

[Terwox]

eh, is that really a passive aggressive swipe?

I mean, games always get sold on what makes them different from what's currently there, and if they want to market to people who have been playing D&D but are more interesting in theme/mood/buzzword, I dunno, it doesn't seem that awful.

I dunno. I guess, it's not like they said, "Welcome to a game where theme, mood, and plot are important, as opposed to gaining levels and amassing loot."

And heck -- that wouldn't have bothered me either.

It's kind of a selling point for me, D&D -is- a lot about equipment without some heavy editing that I'm not willing to do.

 

[reutbing0]

One of the core things we wanted to do with the new books was to capture that feeling that the first adopters of Vampire got way back in '91 — that feeling of excitement and mystery, of picking up these books where you recognized some aspects of vampires but discovered there was so much more to explore and play with.

And for that I salute you. Thanks for chiming in Ethan.

I got into this whole World of Darkness thing fairly late, I ended my first Vampire chronicle just about a year ago. I had a lot of catching up to do, just to have some clue what all the Meta-plot discussions were all about. While I love the Wolrd of Darkness it has become a cluttered mess. I'm very happy with the idea of starting with a clean slate and returning to the core ideas of what made the original WoD great.

 

[DrZombie]

For me there was one book that made it all come together : dirty little secrets of the black hand. I loved that book, and was very disappointed when the setting got blown up in the last edition.. Aaah well, I just used the old setting and went my own way. The good thing about WoD was that you could go any way you wanted, from angst-ridden goth chicks to bloodthirsty maniacs. One of my friends is drewling at the thought of the new setting, another one swears that it's just a sham to get our money. Me, I'll just wait and see, although I fear it'll be a bit too recognisable, with allmost-brujah arguing with almost-ventrue, but, I'll tell ya when I've played my first game.

 

[Vocenoctum]

Hey, if we were going by the same staggering of the release schedule that marked the first couple of editions of each, Mage fans would have to wait until 2006. Puts it into perspective, doesn't it?

But, the original games weren't replacing a current game. The Mage 2nd edition & revised editions didn't have a year gap from the previous Mage product. I just wish they'd (well, you'd had them more planned out/ ready to go when Gehenna (and the rest) ended it all.

There's a vast difference between rich background and ongoing metaplot. Requiem is going to have the former in spades — the world just won't wind up evolving in different directions than the players' own games.

I have to disagree with that idea, for the simple matter of details are why I buy RPG products. I never use anything as written, but I need the basis, or it's pointless to get the stuff. I'm sure the new WoD will have some fine details, but without an evolving plot, there's less worth in me picking up the product. That being said, I haevn't run any WoD for a while since my players don't really like the system. I'll read WoD in the store, but I'm not expecting enough rules changes to get the group behind it.

Besides, my favorites were Hunter & Demon...

 

[Welverin]

Thanks for the links reutbing0, I'd been wondering how long the books would be.

Yes, you will. I'm one of the three primary writers (not counting Justin Achilli, the developer, of course) on V:tR. (The other two being the fabulous C. A. Suleiman and Dean Shomshak.)

Cool.

Good job on the Gehenna novel, by the way. On a selfish note, I hope you can get your other novels publish so I can read them as well.