Waking up and Fumbles: Need rules help
Crothian
First Post
To wake up I require a listen check. Ussually the DC is 20, but it really depends on what the sounds are and the situations.
For fumbles, I only worry about them if the attack is a natural one. Then I require a reflex save DC 15 unless specific circumstances change this. If you make the save you roll a d20 on a fuble chart, if you miss you roll a d20 on the critcal fumble chart.
For fumbles, I only worry about them if the attack is a natural one. Then I require a reflex save DC 15 unless specific circumstances change this. If you make the save you roll a d20 on a fuble chart, if you miss you roll a d20 on the critcal fumble chart.
Dr. Zoom
First Post
Re: Re: Waking up and Fumbles: Need rules help
No, it's a variant rule in the DMG (page 65). When you roll a natural 1 on your attack roll, you must succeed at a dex check (DC 10) or fumble.kreynolds said:What the hell is a Fumble check?Is that a throwback from 2nd Edition?
Crothian
First Post
Leopold said:
It depends on distance and what weapons and who is fighting. Loud groling monsters or metal on metal would make it a lot easier to wake up. Or if your compainions are yelling at you.
But sometimes if your ambushed at your camp, the enemy is trying to be quiet even during the battle, so the DC is more difficult. I play it totally by ear.
Kershek
Sci-Fi Newshound
I give sleeping characters -10 to their listen check. I read this in a module somewhere and liked it.
Remember that pitched battle is a -20 to a move silently check, with +1 for every 10 feet, IIRC.
So, if I have a sleeping character with a +6 on listen and a fight breaks out about 20 yards (60 feet) away with a 10 being the worst rolled out of all combatants on move silently to determine how loud the fight is, then the character would have to roll a 5 to hear it and wake up. This is assuming that no one in the fight is shouting at the guy telling him to wake up.
The calculation:
penalties: -31 total
-10 sleeping
-6 for 60 feet away
-10 move silently roll
bonii: +26 total
+20 pitched battle
+6 listen for sleeping character
Therefore, the character has to roll a 5 to wake up.
Remember that pitched battle is a -20 to a move silently check, with +1 for every 10 feet, IIRC.
So, if I have a sleeping character with a +6 on listen and a fight breaks out about 20 yards (60 feet) away with a 10 being the worst rolled out of all combatants on move silently to determine how loud the fight is, then the character would have to roll a 5 to hear it and wake up. This is assuming that no one in the fight is shouting at the guy telling him to wake up.
The calculation:
penalties: -31 total
-10 sleeping
-6 for 60 feet away
-10 move silently roll
bonii: +26 total
+20 pitched battle
+6 listen for sleeping character
Therefore, the character has to roll a 5 to wake up.
Last edited:
Celebrim
Legend
Fumbles are an optional or house rule, most often used I'd assume by 1st edition players who remember the old critical hit and fumble tables. The most common rule I've seen is that if you roll a 1, you must roll a DEX check vs. DC 10 modified by the sort of things that effect balance. If you fail, something bad happens - you fall down, you drop your weapon, your bowstring breaks, you make an attack on someone other than your target, you make an attack on yourself, you become flatfooted etc. I find the 'something bad' to be a little vague, and would probably devise a table if I were using this rule.
I've never seen Croatian's fumble and critical fumble tables, but I'd assume that would be the sort of thing you'd be looking for.
Waking up requires a listen check, but you may only take 0. This means that essentially, anything better than your listen skill bonus beats your listen check. That is rather rude, since sleeping characters are helpless and your average 1st level rouge (or bugbear) would beat most sleepers AND at the least could certainly get within 30' of most any sleeper for a ranged sneak attack (provided he could see in the dark), but it's not far from reasonable. A less cruel DM might give you a -10 penalty on the listen check, so there was at least some chance of waking up vs. an averagely sneaky creature. Also, many DM's rule that you may only take a partial action on the round you wake up, even if you do wake up.
I've seen a really nifty Feat roaming about the net called 'Light Sleeper' that let you make a listen check even when asleep, and let you take full actions even on the round you wake up. It might be in the Net Book of Feats.
Gromm, I'm pretty sure that the difficulty for hearing combat is a good bit less than 0, something like -15 or lower, so that the average person could always hear the din of battle a good 100' yards away or more, or in a room on the other side of a stone wall, and so forth.
I've never seen Croatian's fumble and critical fumble tables, but I'd assume that would be the sort of thing you'd be looking for.
Waking up requires a listen check, but you may only take 0. This means that essentially, anything better than your listen skill bonus beats your listen check. That is rather rude, since sleeping characters are helpless and your average 1st level rouge (or bugbear) would beat most sleepers AND at the least could certainly get within 30' of most any sleeper for a ranged sneak attack (provided he could see in the dark), but it's not far from reasonable. A less cruel DM might give you a -10 penalty on the listen check, so there was at least some chance of waking up vs. an averagely sneaky creature. Also, many DM's rule that you may only take a partial action on the round you wake up, even if you do wake up.
I've seen a really nifty Feat roaming about the net called 'Light Sleeper' that let you make a listen check even when asleep, and let you take full actions even on the round you wake up. It might be in the Net Book of Feats.
Gromm, I'm pretty sure that the difficulty for hearing combat is a good bit less than 0, something like -15 or lower, so that the average person could always hear the din of battle a good 100' yards away or more, or in a room on the other side of a stone wall, and so forth.
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