D&D (2024) Warlock brainstorm

[Ath'kethin]

I'd like the designers to spend some time conceiving of some takes on the class that aren't focused around blasting, and add more options to accommodate those takes.

I can't tell you how much I hate Eldritch Blast, and how I feel the Warlock's focus on it completely kneecaps what would otherwise be the most flavorful and interesting class in the game.

 

[mellored]

No spellcasting!

Pact Magic, as an invocation!

Select a spell from the warlock list. You can cast it once per short rest. It scales, and you need to be the minimum level.
You can take this invocation more than once.

That actually solves some odd interaction with stuff, like Paladin smiting or sorcerer dumping it for sorcerer points.

 

[Minigiant]

I'm also in favor of alternatives to Eldrich Blast, though I'd suggest some of those alternatives should be less overtly magical. A lot of the flavor and class design for Warlocks suggest a tendency to be more subtle with their magic use than WIzards or Sorcerers, so they should have some options for their default attack that lean into that.

That would be my preference as well.

Like warlocks would have their own cantrips not on a list. Some wold be overt combat powers like eldritch blast and eldritch slash.

Other could be combat viable but not damaging like a binding spell that summons chains (fiend), vines (archfey), tentacles (GOO and fathnomless), or bony hands to restrain and slow foes at will.

Others could be noncombat. Mask of Many Face could be its own new cantrip. Same with Eldritch Sight and Beast Speech.

In a lower combat campaign or at a table where damage is covered by some other members of the party, a warlock should be about to take all exploration, social, and nondamage combat spells and lean more on spell slots. The warlock should be able to do a cursed seer gimmick or an oracle of a great nondiety, or a classic pactmaker with all thus weird power.

 

[ECMO3]

What are some changes you would like to see to the warlock?

I would like to see them get rid of hexblade or substantially rework it thematically. Making a pact with your mace just doesn't do it for me thematically ..... and then when you find an awesome weapon that is better all of a sudden that is your favored weapon?

 

[MechaTarrasque]

My main thing is that it feels like the warlock has to do a lot of work, and what is the point of selling your soul if you still have to work hard?

I figure the warlock ought to be a smart guy or girl (or whatever) who thinks it isn't fair that his/her/their brains don't get as much respect as some big fighter or barbarian's muscles, the rogues fancy footwork, or the bard's charm (I am going with warlock as an int caster).

The main feature of the warlock becomes otherworldly aspect. He/she/they can still have eldritch blast and hex and what not, but that is just stuff they do. Otherworldly aspect is what they want.

So, if the warlock chooses an archelemental patron, their aspect lets them use their int modifier for their strength modifier (and we can throw in some weapons proficiency, etc.) Charles Atlas, eat your heart out.

The archfey patron gives your aspect fey's grace (use your int modifier for your dex modifier, including for initiative). And we can throw in some proficiency with ranged weapons and light weapons.

The undead patron gives your aspect undead fortitude (int modifier for con modifier and a bunch of temporary hit points).

Do you see how many tentacles and eyes aberrations have? They ought to have really good perception scores, which means the GOO patron gives the warlock's aspect the ability to See the World as It Is (use int modifier for wisdom modifier and some psychic stuff).

Sure, some people might make deals with fiends to become some big, nasty monster, but most people would rather be loved or feared (and summon a big, nasty monster), so prepare to be the life of the party or the scariest guy in the room with Fiendish Presence (use int modifier for cha modifier and expertise in persuasion or intimidation).

The other big thing I would do is make the book, blade, and familiar into invocations. You have to pick one at 3rd level (or 1st if they make subclasses start then), but if you want, you can get all 3.

Minorly, I would make planar ally a mystic arcanum spell (adding fey and undead to the possibilities) with the understanding that warlocks always have to pay (there are some benefits from getting power from a god your worship, and the possibility of cheap labor is one of them).

I think fighters and rogues should get a 1/3rd caster based on the warlock (specifically the blade) to go with the subclasses based on the wizard (spell thief and eldritch knight). It would be easier to work the "I just want a frontline guy with a magic sword and some spells" that a lot of blade pact players seems to want (although why your warlock would want to risk his/her/their life on the frontline is a good question) then even the archelemental patron would do, and it would also take care of some of the warlock players who might be put off by the focus on otherworldly aspect.

 

[Clint_L]

When a class is mostly defined by one ability, that's a design problem IMO. Players having options makes the game more fun, but with Warlocks the correct option most of the time is "cast Eldritch Blast" and the correct thing to do with invocations is "make Eldritch Blast even better." So I do think they need to be given a little more to work with.

For example, if they have to be built around Eldritch Blast, add invocations that give Eldritch Blast different options that players can choose between, rather than just stacking improvements. So that the players get to choose which flavour of Eldritch Blast they will use. Maybe one option does less damage but also transfers it as healing to an ally. Maybe another option also dispels magic. That kind of thing.

Counter-argument: the game needs simple classes because that's what some players prefer, and that also offers an easier entry point for new players. So maybe it needs Warlocks to remain basic so they can act as entry-level spell casters.

Side Note: as a zillion other people have noted since 2014, it is weird to build the class so heavily around Eldritch Blast yet leave it as an optional cantrip rather than making it an automatic ability. Pity the newbie Warlock who doesn't know better and doesn't take it as one of their two cantrips.

 

[Pauln6]

When a class is mostly defined by one ability, that's a design problem IMO. Players having options makes the game more fun, but with Warlocks the correct option most of the time is "cast Eldritch Blast" and the correct thing to do with invocations is "make Eldritch Blast even better." So I do think they need to be given a little more to work with.

For example, if they have to be built around Eldritch Blast, add invocations that give Eldritch Blast different options that players can choose between, rather than just stacking improvements. So that the players get to choose which flavour of Eldritch Blast they will use. Maybe one option does less damage but also transfers it as healing to an ally. Maybe another option also dispels magic. That kind of thing.

Counter-argument: the game needs simple classes because that's what some players prefer, and that also offers an easier entry point for new players. So maybe it needs Warlocks to remain basic so they can act as entry-level spell casters.

Side Note: as a zillion other people have noted since 2014, it is weird to build the class so heavily around Eldritch Blast yet leave it as an optional cantrip rather than making it an automatic ability. Pity the newbie Warlock who doesn't know better and doesn't take it as one of their two cantrips.

I had it and got rid because it was boring and not thematic for my shadow pact/blackflame warlock. I prefer firebolt and blackflame blade cantrips. Mind you, it's only DM approved custom feats that make it work and a recently added dark gift from Ravenloft.

 

[Clint_L]

For example, if they have to be built around Eldritch Blast, add invocations that give Eldritch Blast different options that players can choose between, rather than just stacking improvements. So that the players get to choose which flavour of Eldritch Blast they will use. Maybe one option does less damage but also transfers it as healing to an ally. Maybe another option also dispels magic. That kind of thing.

Building on my suggestion above, maybe add another class of invocation, so that in addition to the current system, each round players can choose one from between a number of different temporary invocations. So that's where more choice could come from; the idea being that your patron is taking an active role in your survival.

Though that might tread too close to sorcery points, so I dunno.

 

[CreamCloud0]

Maybe this is because I’ve just been looking at a vancian casting thread but a fair few of warlock’s invocations are just ‘you get a free casting of X 1/LR’, why not just expand that to cover their entire spell list and just turn it into a base class feature, you’ve still got your limited slots that can be used for casting whatever you need to in the moment but you also have X slots that you can pre-prepare any spells you know in, keep the invocation ones for exclusive spells that don’t appear on their natural spell list.

Agree on more alternatives and variations to eldritch blast but also make the EB modification invocations just affect all cantrips as standard (where applicable, you’re not getting agonising blast bonus damage on minor illusion or thaumaturgy for example)

Patrons being associated with specific damage types or status is interesting IMO, fiend patron adds fire damage to your EB, archfey charm and great old one psychic damage, ect...

 

[CleverNickName]

What are some changes you would like to see to the warlock?

I think we have plenty of subclasses, but not very many Pacts. We have Pact of the Blade, Pact of the Chain, and Pact of the Tome in the Player's Handbook, and Tasha's Cauldron of Everything added the Pact of the Talisman. That's it.

We could have Pact of the Atheme. Pact of the Cauldron. Pact of the Wand. Pact of the Chalice, or Besom, or Bell. There is so much design space here that isn't getting used. If done right, they could enhance all warlock subclasses in different ways.