D&D 5E Warlock, Hex, and Short Rests: The Bag of Rats Problem

[Mercule]

Well if the character gets in a legit fight, who could argue against letting him use the spell? But this is kind of a silly response since there aren't any villagers in the dungeon. Bag o' villagers is a whole different set of problems.

I think any of the arguments are kinda silly. Either your table is cool with free hexing or not. By the time you get to punching villagers, the wheels are off the bus.


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[zaratan]

You just made a DM ruling or judgment call based on inferences you drew from several related rules. That's perfectly fine.

And I remember that game designer confirmed that on twitter. And unlike some bad calls, that confirmation never changed.

 

[Ganymede81]

And I remember that game designer confirmed that on twitter. And unlike some bad calls, that confirmation never changed.

It is very important to point out that Mike Mearls' tweets are not actual rules answers. They are exclusively rulings on how he would play situations in his own games.

Only Jeremy Crawford's tweets amount to genuine rules answers/clarifications.



That said, I do think Mearls' feedback can be a useful tool for DMs ruling on this situation, though sometimes he and Crawford can contradict.

 

[zaratan]

It is very important to point out that Mike Mearls' tweets are not actual rules answers. They are exclusively rulings on how he would play situations in his own games.

Only Jeremy Crawford's tweets amount to genuine rules answers/clarifications.



That said, I do think Mearls' feedback can be a useful tool for DMs ruling on this situation, though sometimes he and Crawford can contradict.

Yep, but every old and wrong tweet from Mearls was corrected by Crawford later, this one is from 2014, I really think this would be too if was the case.

 

[Ganymede81]

Yep, but every old and wrong tweet from Mearls was corrected by Crawford later, this one is from 2014, I really think this would be too if was the case.

In the other times this topic was raised, I had already combed through Mearls' and Crawford's tweets to see if the topic was revisited, but it never was (at least as of late 2016).

 

[lowkey13]

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[zaratan]

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, or some other pithy saying.

Put another way- just because some corrections are made at a certain point, doesn't mean that all corrections are made. All we do know is that Mearls acknowledges that his tweets are rulings that he would make for his game, and do not carry official imprimatur.

Perhaps someone should tweet the Bag o' Rats at him, if they are confident of the response?

Some not, all wrong tweets from 2014 that I remember were corrected later. Maybe I'm wrong too, and there is one or more tweets that wasn't, but until I see that I'll keep the 100% conviction that, at least RAI, you can concentrate and get the benefits from short rest. And again, is RAw, to me, since nothing states otherwise.
By the way, his answer was exactly about hex, and there is about bag-of-rats too.
To me, I can't see any problem with hex and bag of rats, before you curse another creature you need to use your action to kill the rat and the bonus action to curse the new one, what's the unbalance?
Looks how they design the UA hexblade curse with curse bringer to avoid the bag-of-rats trick. Why they did that with hexblade curse but not with hex? Because bag-of-rats would break the hexblade mechanically, hex born for that.

http://www.sageadvice.eu/2016/10/19/spell-after-an-encounter/
http://www.sageadvice.eu/2014/09/20/concentration-during-rest/
http://www.sageadvice.eu/2015/10/02/hex-concentration/
http://www.sageadvice.eu/2014/09/19/hexplained/

 

[lowkey13]

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[lowkey13]

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[MrHotter]

Also, I find it interesting that the closest you get to an official ruling on Hex is this, from Sage Advice (JC edition):

"Curious about the spell’s intent? The spell is meant to be a classic jinx—the sort seen in folklore—that is useful in and out of combat. In combat, the spell provides some extra necrotic damage. Outside combat, you could foil a cunning diplomat, for example, by casting the spell and imposing disadvantage on his or her Charisma checks."

Again, this is not a rules clarification, but this off-hand language (answering a question about hex on ability checks v. saving throws) illuminates the intent of the spell; which is to say, that it is to be used as a "classic jinx;" not as something that you target on a sacrificial rat. Which again goes to the distinction between tables; those who view hex as, well, a hex, and those who view "hex" as a set of rules that intersect with other rules that may be gamed to your advantage.

The way your table approaches the game will likely determine which approach you take.

That's the way I view hex, and why I think a warlock would want to keep it active for a while. He can give an NPC a very bad day even if he never uses the hex to harm him.

It's similar to how a ranger can use their hunter's mark to make it nearly impossible for his quarry to shake pursuit.

My table rule is what someone said on the first page. A player can maintain concentration during a short rest, but he would not be able to gain back the spell slot for a spell that is being concentrated on.